hypertension Smc L, R, Or S?

[meghp0405]

John999, did you have a bad experience with a VSO? Not all are ignorant as you suggest, maybe one just told you the facts and not what you wanted to hear? I get that one a lot. Vets don't hear what they want to hear so I'm the bad guy and don't know what I'm doing. But when I'm able to show my answers in the 38 CFR or the M1-21, then they become quiet and don't know what to say.

[FormerMember]

Meghp0405

I don't think John had a "bad experience" with a VSO, per se. I think it is just endemic that ignorance reigns among the ranks of VSOs. Consider it a "two-tiered" operation.This much I know. There is a hunter/gatherer employee version who does nothing but collect POAs. S/he occupies a desk at the office and does intake. It's a Walmart "meet and greet" job. If you were to delve a little deeper, you would realize how shallow their knowledge is. A three week course with no "final exam" and 40 hours of training with refresher courses annually does not a sharp NSO make.

Filing claims for Vets is an awesome responsibility. Phraseology can be a make or break part of it. Knowledge, above all else, is king in this industry. Quite frankly, I haven't met any who fill the bill. I'm sure they exist somewhere and are not all that rare but I personally haven't met one. I had a one-on-one social interaction with a VFW NSO in Pennsylvania recently. He called me out and asked for names and ratings for some of the Vets I had helped get 100% + on VA claims. I gave him the info and asked him how many he had accomplished. His number was ambiguous and he could not or would not supply names-suddenly citing security and privacy policies. When pushed, he admitted his "post" had done this collectively. It was not a personal accomplishment. In fact, as an official "rated NSO" capable of representing Vets, he drives the VFW meatwagon and picks up Vets for transportation to appointments at the VAMC. That is all he does besides collect POAs and answer the phone. While this is an admirable endeavour, it isn't on a par with actual cutting edge, claims adjudication. After a long week of eliciting the truth out of him, it turns out he has never actually engaged in working claims for Vets other than his own claim. They have an experienced cadre of three who are the shield bearers. These three, in turn, consult with a regional supervisory staff who give them advice and their marching orders. CFR knowledge? They don't need it. That's why they have supervisors.

NSOs, left to their own devices, are woefully unsuited to the task of defending Vets. Hillary Clinton's touchy-feely It Takes a Village is far more apropos as an analogy where VSOs are concerned. I have had three. Each was from a different VSO and each was used at a different time for different claims. Each one had the same outcome.

DAV provided me with a well-meaning but extremely overworked NSO who was ill-equipped and unknowledgeable. They managed to eke out a "win" for me at the BVA in 1992-0% and 0% for hearing/tinnitus. It was an open and shut case easily proved at the RO by my audiograms. Why it went to DC is a mystery. What they did not win was my back claim. It was well-documented by SMRs which DAV did not take advantage of or use to rebut VA. My NSO was not a Veteran.

AMVETS in 1994, were clueless. Any question I asked about AO had to be referred to National Hqrs. The answers were garbled and my NSO abruptly moved on to become a used car salesman in the middle of the claim. No one was assigned to take his place. My claim died for lack of a timely Form 9 filing. My NSO was not a Veteran.

MOPH is probably a stand up organization in most places but not here in Seattle. My NSO told me it was futile to file any AO claims as VA simply wasn't granting them. Why try? Same for Hepatitis C claims. He mistakenly believed STDs and tattoos were willful misconduct and thus not compensable. They are not but that is immaterial. I don't have any tattoos and I've never had the clap or VD. Why he felt that was pertinent escapes me. He never explained it. I discovered almost by accident I needed a nexus letter to connect my disease to service. Again, my NSO was rude and said everybody knows this is required. I obtained one and they claimed they filed it. None could be found in the C-file. I refiled it myself directly with VA and was told if I went around him again, they would drop my representation. When I explained I was too ill to work, he handed me a Form 21-8940 for TDIU. With a 0%/0% rating, I strongly doubt VA was going to grant TDIU. My NSO was not a Veteran.

I decided to go it alone with my meager intelligence and won everything. This illustrates little. My desire to win drove me to learn what was needed. I don't see that in NSOs. They seem to be comfortable with filling out forms and warming seats. I have called many VSOs to ask procedural questions about proper filing protocols. Every last one has asked me to call their "chief legal honcho" between the hours of ____ and ____ on (pick a weekday) and pose the question to him. Some of them have had to research what I consider bright line rules and get back to me. This does not inspire confidence in the process. It's not much of a testimonial to the viability of VSO jurisprudence.

Every legal venue has its pitfalls. VSOs exist to help unknowledgeable Vets file claims. If they are legally challenged in their own right, they can hardly be of assistance to us. Having a NSO go into a VA hearing with you and beg for benefit of the doubt is a fool's errand yet it happens day in and day out. I'm sure they mean well but so did Chicken Little. After 23 years of attempting to obtain justice from VA, one thing is glaringly obvious. VSOs work hat in hand with the VA. Collusion is too strong a word but there it is. The hierarchy exist at the whim of Congress and VA. They get free room and board at VAROs. They are paid by the government for every signed POA they turn in. They get no bonus for a win. They get no black mark for a loss. They are not fired if a deadline for filing an appeal comes and goes unanswered. They are generally inaccessible for consultation and if they were accessible, it would be a waste of time due to their lack of knowledge. Face it. When a NSO tells you to file for HCV as a residual of Agent Orange, you are in trouble. This happens day in and day out. Nowhere in 3.309(e) will you find HCV listed as a presumptive yet you see these on appeal at the BVA from the Big Six every year in droves. You see Vets being led to the slaughter every year by the same outfits with no nexus letter. In each case the VLJ politely says " Lay testimony is all well and fine but the Vet has no medical training so he cannot opine as to the etiology of his illness or injury. On the other hand, the VA examiner has reviewed the C-file and stated s/he feels it is not at least as likely as not that the injury sustained in service is not related to the current malady. As this is the only medical opinion on record, the Board will accept it." Where, pray tell, is the Vet's IMO? Why is it that the VSO has not performed due dilligence and provided him with one to rebut the VA? 50,000 Vets represented by VSOs appeal every year. Fewer than 25,000 possess a valid nexus or IMO. What, pray tell, is the purpose of the VSO/NSO if not to prepare the Vet for this with the tools to win?

Legal scholars and VSOs have known for over one hundred years that we need three things to prove our case. Nevertheless, it seems to be news to each and every one of the VSOs I deal with that you cannot win without them. While VA is not in the habit of fighting you to the mat on a presumptive for DM2 and AO, they fought me tooth and nail over Porphyria from 1994 to 2008. My VSO neglected to go into the minutiae regarding the requirement of having to manifest it to a compensable degree within a year of leaving RVN nor did they point out I could win it on a direct basis. The mantra was simply "File! File! File!"

Somewhere in America there are compassionate, caring VSOs with lots of legal acumen, Megh0405. I have no doubt. Just because I have never witnessed it does not rule it out. I believe the world is round but the evidence I see points to a flat earth. In closing, I must share that the Tacoma, Wa. American Legion NSO who repped my best friend (before I took over as a silent partner) showed up after three years of silence and being AWOL after he finally won at the BVA. He wanted a group photo of them all for his trophy wall (in the bar). Keep in mind that this gentleman had not filed anything for them since Tom's Form 9 in 2008. He didn't show up for the Board videoconference hearing. No one from AmLeg was present in DC to shepherd his claim through. Nothing. This is the second one I've heard of personally for a photo op. I'm hoping Senator Tennis shoes shows up on my doorstep with CBS in tow and wants to present me my retro check for my 1994 claim. Publisher's Clearinghouse doesn't hold a candle to these chowderheads.

If you are a NSO, I apologize if I have impugned your good works. It may be you have an abundance of legal acumen. Experience tells me most don't but you get tarred and feathered by the company you keep. Thank you for not being selfish and choosing to serve America. Only 7% of us hear the call and sign up. I apologize also for putting this in a SMC forum, but since you queried Mr. Basser on it, I felt the subject was fair game.

Edited July 27, 2013 by asknod

[carlie]

John999, did you have a bad experience with a VSO? Not all are ignorant as you suggest, maybe one just told you the facts and not what you wanted to hear? I get that one a lot. Vets don't hear what they want to hear so I'm the bad guy and don't know what I'm doing. But when I'm able to show my answers in the 38 CFR or the M1-21, then they become quiet and don't know what to say.

meghp,

For the record, most of the comments you read that knock VSO's

relate to VSO's that are not very familiar with the majority of what's contained

in USC, 38 CFR and/or M21-1MR.

If you find one that is familiar enough with the laws and regs to actually help

you out on an issue - you have to spend time listening to how great they are

and follow up with boosting their egos even more.

Then if you happen across one that has ever heard of, seen or buys and reads the VBM, it's

about time to fall down and kiss the ground.

Important to also keep in mind is that many of the comments relating to service org.s and officers

are about one's from the 70's to current date.

I know of several current VSO's that don't know squat.

I, as a layperson have had to personally spell many things out for them.

When a claimant goes to a VSO and knows what they are talking about

regarding their claim issues, evidence, laws, regs and how all of this is to

be applied -

the VSO's that I have encountered, don't like it too much.

Also, if a claimant gets a newbie rep, not yet seasoned - good luck,

but about the same goes for a newbie, unseasoned VA decision maker.

For some reason unknown to me, both of the judges that I presented to at my

BVA hearings - were appreciative of my making their task much easier, for them.

JMHO

NORAD, sorry for trampling over the issue you posted to start this thread.

[FormerMember]

<<<Then if you happen across one that has ever heard of, seen or buys and reads the VBM, it's

about time to fall down and kiss the ground.>>>

Well. That's a fine how-do-you-do. Now who's going to get the hot chocolate off my monitor screen? Do you know how much that hurts the inside of your nose?

[NORAD 76]

NORAD, sorry for trampling over the issue you posted to start this thread.

No problem, Carlie. This whole thread has been quite enlightening to me.

UPDATE: I filed for SMC in May 2013. In July, I got a letter from VA telling me that they had received my application for PENSION. Sure enough, EBenefits shows that I now had a claim opened for pension--something that I didn't request, and of which I'm not elgible.

I visited my DAV office and voiced my concerns. They told me that I had to speak to the VA regarding this, so I waited an extra 30 minutes to speak with a VA rep.

Of course, the VA rep told me that they couldn't help me, and that I needed to speak with DAV (again).

OK, enough of this crap. I went back to the DAV, and said I needed to speak with a VSO. The receptionist tried to blow me off again, but I interrupted her, and told her that It appeared that my claim had been misapplied, and the DAV had to fix it. She begrudgingly told me to wait for the VSO.

The VSO admitted that "an error had been made," and assured me that it would be fixed post-haste. By the time I got home, EBenefits showed that the PENSION claim was closed out, and a COMPENSATION claim was created with the correct creation date.

The moral of the story seems to be in harmony with some of the comments on this thread: the Veteran needs to do his own research and understand the process. Were it not for this forum, I wouldn't have noticed the discrepancy, and my claim would've probably been denied (after languishing around for months and months). I had to spot the error, and force the VSO to correct it. Lesson learned.

[carlie]

NORAD - Good on you - job well done.

asknod - kinda burns to the bone if it's real hot : - )