Service Connection Injuries

[Mcafee]

Hello all hope all is well. I have been racking my brain to say the least my Question is this ( If you are injured on Active Duty upon discharge from Military Services. Who is responsible for The injury or injuries?Is the burden placed on the Veteran to follow up or is it the Military Services or the VA.? I am a little confused here with this .I know the Federal Citation that Iam arguing with the US. Army is clear however if the Services know you are or were injured to make the process user friendly?

[rentalguy1]

it is the responsibility of the vet to file a claim with the VA. Although, they have been trying to make it really easy for the last many years.

[Berta]

Any injury while on active duty is treated and documented in the SMRs and noted on the discharge physical-that isnt the case all the time however-

I have friend who received GSW to arm in combat, was patched up, returned to combat within a few days, never got the PH and he doesnt know if this is found as having been treated in his SMRs or on his discharge physical.He has never gotten his records.

In any event this was an inservice injury.It was his responsibility to file a claim for it and also to question with a DD 149 why he didnt get the PH.

If a vet gets a medical discharge, then as a veteran they have to obtain continued medical care for the disability-privately or at the VA- and it is their responsibility to file a claim for it- they should not wait to do that.

These days unlike after the Vietnam War and the Persian Gulf War, the military is supposed to be provided better transition methods for newly discharged.

They insist the serviceperson gets a complete copy of their SMRs before they formally leave the service.

Also, my daughter went through this when she was discharged 3 years ago- the Mil provides lots of outprocessing briefings and she said the VA briefing was pretty good as far as claims go (but of course it was not the Real story)

Inservice military who also earned college credits have separate educational briefings for that.

Active military can even begin the claims process prior to discharge these days.

For claims filed within one year after discharge, the EED retro date-if the claim is awarded is the day after their discharge.This was definitely stressed in the VA briefings -my daughter mentioned.

Things are better yet many newly discharged vets still dont get all the info they need as to claims and the VA.

Unfortunately I missed a chance to talk to Congressman Filner on this recently-at SVR-the shows host discussed this with me prior to the show and was hoping that I would call in directly -as Congressman Filner had asked us for some transition needs we know of-

I lost the entire Sattelite connection-and even got a pop up from the sat service that they were having major problems.very disappointing- but Filner will be back on soon-

Most of the vets here probably received very little outprocessing advice at all-as to any disabilties they had or injuries from service and how to file a claim.

Once the discharge process takes place most vets are still on their own in many ways.

I made many transition suggestions to the Dole Shalala commission.

It is a shame that many vets who served prior to the Iraq War never really got the info they needed while they were still in the Mil.

The "Transition process" for Vietnam combat veterans didnt even seem to exist.Many of them returned to a country that was completely against them,If they didnt have PTSD already from combat they probably got it when they stepped off the plane.

And if they did return with PTSD the VA didnt know what is was until 1983.That is when the VA started paying comp for it.

PTSD is as old as warfare itself but it didnt help these vets to think they were alone and crazy when in fact they had a bonafide combat disability.

[Mcafee]

I have to agree that most Veterans from WWII and Korea,Vietnam,Even Peacetime Were not informed of entitlements for themselves and family for sustained injuries while serving in the military.But what i dont understand is that the AGENCIES know,Benefits are inplace for injured servicemen and women.Yet they eithier lie or misdirect or ignore in hopes you will go away.This is Gross Negligence on all Parties concerned Government Agencies whether it be Military services or DOD or VA.I also would like to mention that even if you did have a VSO back in the day I truly believe they were working in cahoots with VARO not to apply correct benefits for Veterans.This is a disgrace and i know knowledge is priceless i wish this was available 30 years ago.Even though the Agency has been negligent one still has to prove oneself to the Agency what an outrage.Please forgive me but! Now i see where BACK LOG comes from.

[allan]

>Please forgive me but! Now i see where BACK LOG comes from.

Much of the backlogs is from raters slam dunking their cases to get a bonus or meet the qoata.

Years of repeated remands to correct these so called,"error's" while raters continue along with the same, lame, game of low balling and doctor shopping is the major cause.

Once evidence is submitted by the veteran to win their claim, the VA raters imediately set that evidence asside and seek the Dr's opinion they want.

[Rockhound]

What no one has noted is, that it is the Veterans responsibility to elect to seek benefits from the service, in which he must see that all injuries and diseases that he claims, are documtented in his medical records as having service origin. It is his right to request a physical evaluation board in order to do this pkrior to seperation from service.

If he elects to file instead for VA benefits and compensation, the above still applies, all injuries and/or desease processes that the Veteran claims, should be noted in their SMR. They can still request a physical evaluation board in order to do this prior to seperation from the service.

I made a dumb decision and might I say, uninformed decision, My father had just died, my mother was by her self, my other siblings had families and jobs, and it seemed the right thing to do, also because the clerk who gave me the paper that I was to sign, electing to file with the VA told me I would receive more in compensation for the same disability than what I would get from the service.

Yea, any person in the service who has an injury or a disease process, whether he thinks it is disabling at the time should still request a physical evaluation board to document at the very least the bade level of an injury during service and a desease process that had it's inception in service or a showing that it was aggrivated by service beyond it's normal progression.

I know I have not stated enough, but the general requirements and information is their.

Rockhound Rider B)

[john999]

Rock

Don't blame yourself. The military has done this to thousands of soldiers and is still doing it to Iraq vets. They just want to get rid of injured soldiers and shift them onto the VA payroll.

[halos2]

Any injury while on active duty is treated and documented in the SMRs and noted on the discharge physical-that isnt the case all the time however-

I have friend who received GSW to arm in combat, was patched up, returned to combat within a few days, never got the PH and he doesnt know if this is found as having been treated in his SMRs or on his discharge physical.He has never gotten his records.

In any event this was an inservice injury.It was his responsibility to file a claim for it and also to question with a DD 149 why he didnt get the PH.

If a vet gets a medical discharge, then as a veteran they have to obtain continued medical care for the disability-privately or at the VA- and it is their responsibility to file a claim for it- they should not wait to do that.

These days unlike after the Vietnam War and the Persian Gulf War, the military is supposed to be provided better transition methods for newly discharged.

They insist the serviceperson gets a complete copy of their SMRs before they formally leave the service.

Also, my daughter went through this when she was discharged 3 years ago- the Mil provides lots of outprocessing briefings and she said the VA briefing was pretty good as far as claims go (but of course it was not the Real story)

Inservice military who also earned college credits have separate educational briefings for that.

Active military can even begin the claims process prior to discharge these days.

For claims filed within one year after discharge, the EED retro date-if the claim is awarded is the day after their discharge.This was definitely stressed in the VA briefings -my daughter mentioned.

Things are better yet many newly discharged vets still dont get all the info they need as to claims and the VA.

Unfortunately I missed a chance to talk to Congressman Filner on this recently-at SVR-the shows host discussed this with me prior to the show and was hoping that I would call in directly -as Congressman Filner had asked us for some transition needs we know of-

I lost the entire Sattelite connection-and even got a pop up from the sat service that they were having major problems.very disappointing- but Filner will be back on soon-

Most of the vets here probably received very little outprocessing advice at all-as to any disabilties they had or injuries from service and how to file a claim.

Once the discharge process takes place most vets are still on their own in many ways.

I made many transition suggestions to the Dole Shalala commission.

It is a shame that many vets who served prior to the Iraq War never really got the info they needed while they were still in the Mil.

The "Transition process" for Vietnam combat veterans didnt even seem to exist.Many of them returned to a country that was completely against them,If they didnt have PTSD already from combat they probably got it when they stepped off the plane.

And if they did return with PTSD the VA didnt know what is was until 1983.That is when the VA started paying comp for it.

PTSD is as old as warfare itself but it didnt help these vets to think they were alone and crazy when in fact they had a bonafide combat disability.

[halos2]

I have a sc back injury that is documented in over 2 months in my SMR's with treatments of PT for 20 times, 13 physician visits, pain meds, heat, ice, rest, OT evaluation and continuation of pain documented with no relief noted and corset or back brace ordered and on my discharge summary form # 89 it is noted:

1) worn back brace or back support

2) back trouble of any kind

3) frequent or severe headaches

4) pain or pressure in chest

5) frequent trouble sleeping

well the back side of the form

However on the reverse side of this form these areas are addressed with no further problems...the specifics I find strange are the date "of my supposed back injury to which they find no further problems is not valid!" There is no such date in my file of such stated injury anywhere in my SMR. The actual date is 2 months later.

Also the form information they refer to is typed in and has one Lt Col name on it and then a Maj name on it too, also the major is the one who initialed and signed both areas. Of coarse when I wrote my information down on the front it had no such typed info on the backside...

They continue to deny my claim (X3) and I had 2 separate Physician statements, previous treatments at the VA later, and a faulty C & P by a nurse practitioner who wrote false info on my exam, and who the VA removed from doing C & P exams related to inconsistencys and many complaints and discovered incorrect statements by her yet they also refuse to use the physician statements and only use her "opinion."

Yet I am very frustrated how the evidence is THERE yet they chose to deny it. I have suffered for over 38 years.

Am still going to pursue this as cannot let them continue with their injustices.

Did request personal hearing and brought up all evidence issues, and still denied, and copy of hearing is not complete of all the info I presented (knew I should have brought my own tape recorder in with me).

Any hinks are greatly appreciated. Best of all to you Great People on this site too!!

[Hoppy]

halos2

yet they also refuse to use the physician statements and only use her "opinion."

You cannot expect the VA to connect all the dots. You must get a report that addresses a nexus between the inservice condition and your current condition. You can request another C&P or get an IMO. It sounds to me like the really blew your claim. Howerver, telling them they blew the claim does not win a claim. Strong medical evidence wins claims. They could be rejecting the physicians statements because they did not follow the proper format. There are doctors who have helped veterans here on hadit who know how to write reports that the VA will listen to. Hopefully folks will post the names of doctors who helped them. I won all my claims by getting VA doctor to write reports for me. VA doctors do not have to write reports. However, they can if the want to. The history you posted while in service is quite powerfull. I have to wonder why you were not SC'd at discharge. The biggest problem you would have is if you had a significant accident or injury after service that the VA is using against you. Get a GOOD SO if you do not have one.

Edited June 29, 2008 by Hoppy (see edit history)

[halos2]

halos2

yet they also refuse to use the physician statements and only use her "opinion."

You cannot expect the VA to connect all the dots. You must get a report that addresses a nexus between the inservice condition and your current condition. You can request another C&P or get an IMO. It sounds to me like the really blew your claim. Howerver, telling them they blew the claim does not win a claim. Strong medical evidence wins claims. They could be rejecting the physicians statements because they did not follow the proper format. There are doctors who have helped veterans here on hadit who know how to write reports that the VA will listen to. Hopefully folks will post the names of doctors who helped them. I won all my claims by getting VA doctor to write reports for me. VA doctors do not have to write reports. However, they can if the want to. The history you posted while in service is quite powerfull. I have to wonder why you were not SC'd at discharge. The biggest problem you would have is if you had a significant accident or injury after service that the VA is using against you. Get a GOOD SO if you do not have one.

[halos2]

Hoppy OMG thank you for your reply. I have learned the hard way to do all of the work on my claim . Bought books by Leggett, 2 by Roche, Parrish a few more, and am on my 3rd printer from copying net info and did ask Jim S. with vawatchdog questions too I found his sight on the web in Jan 08 and found this site 2 weeks ago. I didn't know about service connected injury when I got out in 1970.

Just got m honorable discharge and went home.(figured I just had to tuff it up all these years)

Only started the process first in 2003 then again in 2004. Worked as a nurse over 33 yrs.

Didn't know anything about it...just filled out papers in 2003 and again in 2004again and told to get a SO so I got VFW and that was it. Waited for C & P exams 2 of them and waited ...one granted small amt I was deceased and requested myPersonal Hearing. All alone with my trusty books.

I read about the IMO and took my records and wrote them up and related them to my SMR and medical records all these yrs and the c&p exams and all the diag tests, x-rays, MRI"s, Ct scans etc and gave the record copies to the Dr's along with my reports and they read and signed them. Now I will relate them to my SSDI records too and go back to them.

I had a car accident at 20 mph and further hurt my back as well as 2 falls on wet floors at work and moved a desk in my

office and hurt my back more. My original injury was military and the rest occurred throughout my life. I always wore a back brace and still do since 1969. I worked, raised a family went to colege all these years.

I had abdominal female surgery in 2002 and developed full blown fibromyalgia, and my service related injurys surfaced with avengence. SSDI told me to file in 2003 I did but VA lost some of my papers so I did again 2004...now you know the rest of the story.

Where is there a good SO? I think these sites offer the most respected, intelligent people to deal with the VA around anywhere. Thank again, Hoppy!!

I know Dr Bash does exams, I found his sight last year on the web too but don't have the 3 thousand to pay him. WAs hoping to get the missing link...I estasblished the service connected injury...the disability diag today yet they put up road blocks when I show definitive nexus between the 2. Did you notice ubove where I said they declared me deceased and propoed to sever...yep then after my personal hearing they upped my granted one by 20%(the mone they wanted to sever).

[halos2]

Well I have spent another 20 hours working on my appeal case and have some questions that I hope Berta or Hoppy or someone else with extensive experience may be able to offer me and maybe more guidance.

The VA already has all copies of reports and 2 IMO's so therefore I am working on the 3rd one ...

I will address each diag. as Dr Bash does.

These are the issues I will address:

Herniated nucleus pulpos

Spinal disc herniation

Low back pain

Spondylolisthesis

Degenerative disc disease

Back pain

Straight leg raises

Radicular pain

Foot drop

Spinal stenosis

Chronic back pain

Degenerative disc disease

SSDI records which pertain to % of deficits with exams in relationship to disabilities

I then will contact another physician with all of my facts and documentation and copies of everything to have a prepared report completed to dispute their (VA) refusal to grant.

Did I say I am on my 3rd printer since 2003!!

Anyway do you think they will finally listen, read, acknowledge the errors of their ways, and grant in my favor?

We do not have "real" IMO physicians in this rural area...I have done all of the work thus far and they have reviewed all but I did not specify each and every diag before when I did the report. This time I will.

I will do anything and everything that I believe, even if it is over kill with information to get a favorable result.

One other question...2 yrs after I filled, I put in for IU, and of coarse it was denied as it was dependent upon my grant of back injury as well as my other approved claim...well if I get this approved do I have to refile for the IU?

Remember they tried to stop my disability stating I was "deceased" and also they tried to severe my original granted claim so where does that leave me WHEN this is approved? ( I have to be positive)

Thanks for any info from anyone who thinks they can assist me with my favorable outcome.

[john999]

I believe the VA will lump all your back problems together and give you a rating based on you level of disability which usually means your ROM and other results of a back injury. Are you able to walk, bend over and control your bladder? These are the kinds of things they also consider. Do you use a device to help you walk? Are you in a wheelchair? If you are in chronic pain you should file a claim for depression as secondary to the back injury. Those other injuries that happened after service are a big target for the VA. They will most likely say that these are the reasons you are IU. You fight that with medical opinions that your SC injury is the cause.

[Berta]

Halos 2---Do I understand-

you dont have an IMO from Dr. Bash but you did submit IMos from two other private doctors?

Did those IMos fully support your claim and rule out,by medical evidence,any post service accidents or injuries as causing or contributing to your inservice back problems?

Did VA fully consider those IMOs?

The 50% you have- is the back problem related to the 50% disability?

I agree with Hoppy that this will take a strong Independent medical opinion-

but I seem to understand you have 2 already?

Did the VA fully give reasons and bases for not accepting these IMOs?

Have you claimed additional disability resulting from the falls and maybe even the car accident that aggravated the service connected condition?

"Did request personal hearing and brought up all evidence issues, and still denied, and copy of hearing is not complete of all the info I presented (knew I should have brought my own tape recorder in with me)."

Are you still within any deadlines to respond to on the denial from the hearing-

I mean-have they sent you a formal denial yet with appellate rights?

I assume this claim was filed after the VCAA of 2000.

In your VCAA letter that you got a few months after filing this claim-could you fully comply with everything the VA said they needed?

[halos2]

I believe the VA will lump all your back problems together and give you a rating based on you level of disability which usually means your ROM and other results of a back injury. Are you able to walk, bend over and control your bladder? These are the kinds of things they also consider. Do you use a device to help you walk? Are you in a wheelchair? If you are in chronic pain you should file a claim for depression as secondary to the back injury. Those other injuries that happened after service are a big target for the VA. They will most likely say that these are the reasons you are IU. You fight that with medical opinions that your SC injury is the cause.

[halos2]

john999

The VA refuse to grant me anything for my back injury. I had to resign my nursing job 6 yrs ago after surgery. I was diagnosed with full blown 1)fibromyalgia 2)herniated discs spinal disability 3)depression. A diag chronic back pain all these years,always worn a back brace since initial back injury in service 1969. Use a cane sometimes, knee braces bilateral most of the time,Chronic pain all of the time.

They argue that a minor car accident, 2 falls on wet floor at work, and pulled back moving a desk in my office are the reasons for my back problems. The doctors used the service connected injurys with the reports, and treatments I had from them during the years. I didn't know to have them also relate to the above other injurys and also to the treatments I had at the va in 1985-88.

[halos2]

Halos 2---Do I understand-

you dont have an IMO from Dr. Bash but you did submit IMos from two other private doctors?

Did those IMos fully support your claim and rule out,by medical evidence,any post service accidents or injuries as causing or contributing to your inservice back problems?

Did VA fully consider those IMOs?

The 50% you have- is the back problem related to the 50% disability?

I agree with Hoppy that this will take a strong Independent medical opinion-

but I seem to understand you have 2 already?

Did the VA fully give reasons and bases for not accepting these IMOs?

Have you claimed additional disability resulting from the falls and maybe even the car accident that aggravated the service connected condition?

"Did request personal hearing and brought up all evidence issues, and still denied, and copy of hearing is not complete of all the info I presented (knew I should have brought my own tape recorder in with me)."

Are you still within any deadlines to respond to on the denial from the hearing-

I mean-have they sent you a formal denial yet with appellate rights?

I assume this claim was filed after the VCAA of 2000.

In your VCAA letter that you got a few months after filing this claim-could you fully comply with everything the VA said they needed?

[halos2]

BERTA,

Correct no IMO from Dr Bash. Had 2 others by other dr's who have treated me for years... I had them relate my service connected injurys and write they reviewed my SMR to qualify for in service back injury. They said my service connected injury was the beginning of my back problems. It originated there.

The VA ruled out these 2 IMO as they did not speak of the auto accident, 2 falls on a wet floor( however in one of the dr records it stated he treated me for these injurys and also for back pain from moving furniture in my office).

The VA allowed a nurse pract. to say my service injury was not the reason for my lifelong back probs... She lied on the C&P and I went to the patient advocate and FOIO at the hosp to ammend record, but she had so many errors I wanted a new C&P yet none done. The nurce pract. was removed from doing C&P's because she made so many errors and lied on patient records and exams.

They put her in another part of the hosp. and I spoke to her 2x after the report was written in 2005 and she said she did not write what was in the exam, and someone must have mixed up the files. Of coarse she does't remember any of that now cause it was in 2005.

Had requested medical and complete records 6 times and drove to St Louis one time to get them after calling them first...they said copy machine was broken and they would mail them to me...finally got them after 2 yrs.(4 story building and only 1 copy machine?)

50% ptsd and first had 30% and put in NOD and De Nova for increase and also cause they denied back...they next declared me deceased and had to fight that...

next they tried to sever ptsd and say I didn't file for back problems in time however both were on same NOD...next requested personal hearing to bring up both...

waited over 6 mths just for hearing...

next waited about 6 mths and they said ptsd should have been 50% but still denied back..

Signed VA Form 9 still giving them info as records/files are in holding area prior to DRO to double check before going to DC

The VA gave reasons that 2 Dr's did not discuss post injuries yet one had it in files given to them...............

SO do you think all I need to do is to get the Dr's to write ...futher injuries post service have occurred even though one said the original service connected injury weakened the spinal structure..................

Filled in 2003 they gave me wrong paperwork...refiled in 2004 they lost papers couldn't find my copy, so refiled in 2004 dec

first c&p in july and 2nd in Aug 2005 and you have my timeline for the rest.

[halos2]

Halos 2---Do I understand-

you dont have an IMO from Dr. Bash but you did submit IMos from two other private doctors?

Did those IMos fully support your claim and rule out,by medical evidence,any post service accidents or injuries as causing or contributing to your inservice back problems?

Did VA fully consider those IMOs?

The 50% you have- is the back problem related to the 50% disability?

I agree with Hoppy that this will take a strong Independent medical opinion-

but I seem to understand you have 2 already?

Did the VA fully give reasons and bases for not accepting these IMOs?

Have you claimed additional disability resulting from the falls and maybe even the car accident that aggravated the service connected condition?

"Did request personal hearing and brought up all evidence issues, and still denied, and copy of hearing is not complete of all the info I presented (knew I should have brought my own tape recorder in with me)."

Are you still within any deadlines to respond to on the denial from the hearing-

I mean-have they sent you a formal denial yet with appellate rights?

I assume this claim was filed after the VCAA of 2000.

In your VCAA letter that you got a few months after filing this claim-could you fully comply with everything the VA said they needed?

[halos2]

BERTA, I have posted to you but was not well versed on the use of this site and have not in a direct reply format.

Hopefully you will be able to read what I wrote. If not please get back to me and I will reply again. Thank you.