ptsd Mst Is An Experience. It Is Not A Diagnosis. Your Claim Will Be For Ptsd Most Likely.

[Tbird]

It's important to remember that MST is an experience. It is not a diagnosis or a mental health condition in and of itself.

The claim you will file will mostly likely be for PTSD, MST is one of many causes of PTSD that our veterans face. Most likely a claim for PTSD, however it could be claim for Major Depressive Disorder MDD. Don't get yourself to wrapped up in labels while working your claim, 50% for PTSD pays the same as 50% for MDD. Remember the VA will compensate but they won't validate you.

This forum was set up because when filing a claim for PTSD because of MST there are several very specific items to these claims as far what can be considered evidence and so on.

My biggest concern is that some may come to this forum for some therapy work and it is not designed for that. There are other good sites out there

http://www.vetwow.com and http://ptsdforum.org they deal more with the working through the trauma. We are ill equipped to help anyone work through their trauma, so if you need to do trauma work please seek a resource that has the tools to do this for you.

A note about Validation versus Compensation Below:

This is not meant to sound harsh, just a hard lesson I had to learn and it took me a long time. It's just the way it is.

Validation you get from your therapists, your brothers and sisters here, your friends and your family. Compensation you get from the V.A. don't confuse the two, you can waste a lot of energy trying to get the V.A. to validate your feelings that you've been screwed, it's been my experience that it is not going to happen. Work on your claim for compensation in a methodical, detailed way, go to therapy, talk to your family, yell at the top of your lungs with your car windows closed. Then come back to your claim for compensation and it work it methodically, sharpening, sharpening, always sharpening your claim. The V.A. will hardly ever make you feel validated, I know sometimes we want to jam it down their throats until they get a taste of it themselves, metaphorically speaking, that is. It's a waste of energy I say. When working the claim focus on the mission at hand. The mission is to receive compensation for the disability that you incurred or was aggravated by your service.

As for validation, you get it where you can, it never feels quite like anybody gets it to me, of course I'm still in therapy…so what do I know.

If you really want to aggravate the V.A. help another veteran get their ducks in a row.

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

I get it now. I just dont know how ou r ptsd from mst is different that combat ptsd. Other than it being aimed at maybe men for being men.what is the diff, can anyone say.

Also I notice I went twenty years before bringing up the assault in a claim. Listed everything else first, one and two issues literally at a time, BEFORE being desperate enough to say what I had wanted to say all along, and it STILL wasnt good enough.

I listened to progam last nigt some, missed some. When is a good time to bring up an issue with C.u.e.. Just adress all my issues at once.

What if I need just a copy of my denials and nothing else. Hope this makes sense. M.

[Tbird]

I get it now. I just dont know how ou r ptsd from mst is different that combat ptsd. Other than it being aimed at maybe men for being men.what is the diff, can anyone say.

Also I notice I went twenty years before bringing up the assault in a claim. Listed everything else first, one and two issues literally at a time, BEFORE being desperate enough to say what I had wanted to say all along, and it STILL wasnt good enough.

I listened to progam last nigt some, missed some. When is a good time to bring up an issue with C.u.e.. Just adress all my issues at once.

What if I need just a copy of my denials and nothing else. Hope this makes sense. M.

PTSD is not different from combat or MST. However there are things you can use for evidence that are specific to MST. Like a STD, or an Article 15 or you evaluations drop real low or go real high. Perhaps you didn't report, but did write a letter, tell a friend, talk to chaplain. Perhaps you started having a lot of unexplained health problems. I think these are thing's MST survivors male or female may be different in where to look for evidence and what to look for. If you reported it, there will be a paper trail.

[carlie]

http://www.va.gov/vetapp11/Files4/1133431.txt

Service connection may be granted for any disease diagnosed after discharge, when all the evidence, including that pertinent to service, establishes that the disease was incurred in service.

Presumptive periods are not intended to limit service connection to diseases so diagnosed when the evidence warrants direct service connection. The presumptive provisions of the statute and VA regulations implementing them are intended as liberalizations applicable when the evidence would not warrant service connection without their aid. 38 C.F.R. § 3.303(d) (2010).

For the showing of chronic disease in service, there must be a combination of manifestations sufficient to identify the disease entity and sufficient observation to establish chronicity at the time.

If chronicity in service is not established, evidence of continuity of symptoms after discharge is required to support the claim. 38 C.F.R. § 3.303(b) (2010).

Service connection for PTSD requires medical evidence diagnosing the condition in accordance with 38 C.F.R. § 4.125(a) (i.e., under the criteria of DSM-IV); a link, established by medical evidence, between current symptoms and an in-service stressor; and credible supporting evidence that the claimed in-service stressor occurred. 38 C.F.R. § 3.304(f) (2010).

In cases involving a claim of entitlement to service connection for PTSD based upon personal assault, after-the-fact medical evidence can be used to establish a stressor.

Bradford v. Nicholson, 20 Vet. App. 200 (2006); Patton v. West, 12 Vet. App. 272 (1999).

Because the Veteran is alleging personal assault, the special provisions of

VA Adjudication Procedure Manual M21-1 (M21-1), Part III (Feb. 20, 1996), regarding personal assault must also be considered.

The Manual identifies alternative sources for developing evidence of personal assault, such as private medical records, civilian police reports,

reports from crisis intervention centers, testimonial

statements from confidants such as family members, roommates, fellow service members, or clergy, and personal diaries or journals.

M21-1, Part III, 5.14c(4)(a). When there is no indication in the military record that a personal assault occurred, alternative evidence,

such as behavior changes that occurred at the time of the incident,

might still establish that an in-service stressor incident occurred.

Examples of behavior changes that might indicate a stressor include (but are not limited to): visits to a medical or counseling clinic or dispensary without a specific diagnosis or specific ailment; sudden requests that a military occupational series or duty assignment be changed without other justification; lay statements indicating increased use or abuse of leave without apparent reason; changes in performance or performance evaluations;

lay statements describing episodes of depression, panic attacks or anxiety with no identifiable reasons for the episodes; increased or decreased use of prescription medication; evidence of substance abuse;

obsessive behavior such as overeating or undereating; pregnancy tests around the time of the incident; increased interest in tests for HIV

or sexually transmitted diseases; unexplained economic or social behavior changes; treatment for physical injuries around the time of the claimed trauma but not reported as a result of the trauma; or breakup of a primary relationship.

M21-1, Part III, 5.14c(7)(a)-(o). Subparagraph (9) provides that

"[r]ating boards may rely on the preponderance of evidence to support their conclusions even if the record does not contain direct contemporary evidence.

In personal assault claims, secondary evidence which documents such behavior changes may require interpretation in relationship to the medical diagnosis

by a VA neuropsychiatric physician."

That approach has been codified at 38 C.F.R. § 3.304(f)(3) (2010).

Patton v. West, 12 Vet. App. 272 (1999); YR v. West, 11 Vet. App. 393 (1998).

The Board is mindful of the fact that Veterans claiming service connection for disability due to in-service personal assault face unique problems documenting their claims. Since assault is an extremely personal and sensitive issue,

many incidents of personal assault are not officially reported, and victims of this type of in-service trauma may find it difficult to produce evidence to support the occurrence of the stressor.

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

If my first claim was for back pain 5 months out of the military and they denied saying theres is NOTHING THEY SEE

indicating back pain, YET my smrs are FULL OF BACK( and other), pain issues, treated with pt, medicine, waiting , etc.

IS that a cue. M.

good post Carlie.

Edited February 9, 2012 by mysticcherokee usn vet (see edit history)

[carlie]

If my first claim was for back pain 5 months out of the military and they denied saying theres is NOTHING THEY SEE

indicating back pain, YET my smrs are FULL OF BACK( and other), pain issues, treated with pt, medicine, waiting , etc.

IS that a cue. M.

good post Carlie.

Most likely not a cue - but there would need to be many more questions answered first to get a better picture.

I'd post the information and question - to the CUE forum.

[carlie]

Tbird,

Great explanation and thoughts on your -

"A note about Validation versus Compensation Below"

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

ahhhhhhh! to the cue forum!!!! Ahhhhh, cant do nuthin right! M.

thanks for YOUR POST! dang!

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

cant finde a cue forum, even wit the search feature. it says not here. sigh. Mystic

they changed my anti, hope it helps. my GFC? score is 32, thats bad, huh. THIS IS LITERALLY ALL I DO, but eat and sleep. Dont do the latter very well, do the firt tooo well. JK kinda. Mystic

global fuXXX Capacity

OH and for those of you experiencing body tics (must be something in the water!,) Ive heard quite a few tales of this being an issuw with at least ten people! My neuologist/neuropsychiatrist is the bees kness and wicked intelligent (board certified says a lot)

Anyhoo, he recommended 500 mg of magnesium twice a day. Make sure this isnt an issue with YOUR BODY FIRST, as for once in a while when my fibromyalgia flares, I cannot even take melatonin, and the body produces this stuff on its own. Much less magnesium which was intolerable as well.I think Its the multiple chemical sensitivity that doent exist depending on whom yer talkin to.Alive and well as an issue in the Vets body!

Well I hope this helps someone, as they are annoying. Especially when trying to sleep. Mine happen most often at rest,oddly enough. Your friend and watchful eye for helpful stuff, Mystic

Edited February 10, 2012 by mysticcherokee usn vet (see edit history)

[carlie]

cant finde a cue forum, even wit the search feature. it says not here. sigh. Mystic

http://www.hadit.com/forums/index.php?/forum/78-cue-clear-and-unmistakable-error/

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

TBird, thanks for your comparisons of compensation vs. validation. Mystic

[Tbird]

[hedgey]

Tbird, thanks for an excellent post. You are so right.

Once I took a whooping deep breath and put in the initial claim based on my VA psych diagnosis of PTSD, I, too, pursued my claim with all the energy and passion I could find inside. I was convinced that it was all about getting the VA, the Military, SOMEONE in authority to accept the truth and give me validation.

I wanted the VA to say it was taking responsibility for all the opportunities I ran from, the college degree I didn't finish, the jobs and relationships I sabotaged or dropped out of without a word. I wanted them to say they were sorry. I wanted a letter that said they acknowledged that I was INJURED, hurt, damaged, by another member of the service while I was just trying serve my country. I wanted a hug that I wouldn't cringe from, an apology from someone among the "them" that would give me relief and make me feel better.

Instead, when I got my SC and my rating, I cried and crawled even deeper into my hiding place. Somehow my PTSD being made Official and the reality of it all hit me like a big box of rocks. I didn't feel good about it at all.

It just seemed to say "yeah, you were abused, now you're messed up so bad you can't hold a job, can't have friends, can't get through the day without pills. Yep, we admit it really happened. Here's your compensation back to the date you filed your claim. (shhhhh, never mind the other 25 years). Thank you for your service :) "

I'm trying, trying, trying, not to be bitter. But it's difficult. I'm TDIU to 100% and I'm very grateful for that. I appreciate it, and the other benefits that go with it. But I'd still rather have had a chance to live my life, live up to my potential. I was going to be a psychologist. Ha... the irony is hilarious.

Did I meander too much? I was trying to reinforce Tbird's statement with my own reaction. I hope that's what I did.....

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

Im sooooo sorry this happened to you. I understand as best anybody can, and know that no amount of money will take it back.GIVE IT BACK! Its said that its better than nuthin. I spose if you look at it THAT way, it might help a little.Try not to think about it ever, unless youre in a therapists office. None of it was your fault, you just did the best you could with what that PERP left you, and its GOOD ENOUGH! ITLL HAVE TO BE! Big Warm Hug, Mystic

[Tbird]

Yes Hedgey I do understand and I am glad you found my explanation on validation versus compensation helpful.

In order to get your claim through it's important to remember compensation is the goal. Looking for validation for any of us MST or not is just tilting at windmills IMVHO.

[hedgey]

Thanks, mystic. cyber hugs aren't too scary... :)

Tbird, what you've said gave me a heart-thumping thought. Maybe the only place we'll ever be able to get validation is from... ourselves?

Talk about getting blood from a turnip.

I'm nuts today. I'm going to make a sticky note that says

"I am not a turnip!"

We can start a movement and march on Washington with signs and t-shirts with turnips on them...

Got a case of the nuts that's gotta be it.. I always giggle when I'm shaken or nervous. Dark Humor. Dark Parsnip...

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

I'll march, Im FROM Annapolis, so I'll be glad to show yall round! I just need to get into shape, Sounds ez, eh? NOT! Mystic

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

we should march, million woman march on d.c.

[#1Cavtrooper]

Include me gf, so one million and one women!

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

YOUVE GOT IT! WOO HOO, I know I can depend on YOU! 1,000,001 and counting! Thanks GF! M.

[mysticcherokee usn vet]

Good Morning Brothers and Sisters at Arms,I thought I had current news to report, but it appears that this was a 2011 article and the class action suit against the Military never happened, I don think. Mores the pity! Im gonna go try and get this foot out of my mouf:) pwat!!! ack!!gack!!!

Mystic

Edited February 11, 2012 by mysticcherokee usn vet (see edit history)