New Rule About C&p Results Viewing?

[Opiate73]

VA Moves to Prevent Veteran Violence Over Disability Claims To curtail confusion, the department wants to change when veterans can view the results of their disability exam online.

BY JORDAIN CARNEY

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Information from the exam would be available online after a disability decision has been made.(Joe Raedle/Getty Images)

October 21, 2014 Veterans Affairs officials want to change when veterans can view some of their medical records online, fearing that some could become violent if they see negative comments and think their disability claims will be denied.

Veterans must get a medical exam as part of the process for filing a disability claim for a service-related injury. Within days or weeks of the exam, veterans can see the doctor's forms or notes by using the "Blue Button" on My HealtheVet, the VA's website for health records.

A group of department officials said Monday that they fear some veterans could see the notes from the exam, assume from this partial picture that their claim is being denied, and take out their anger on local VA officials. They voiced their safety concerns Monday to members of the department's Advisory Committee on Disability Compensation at their meeting this week in Washington.

"He walks past the [compensation-and-pension] clinic, and he's very angry. Goes into the C-and-P clinic, and we have an incident of some kind," said Gerald Cross, the chief officer in the Veterans Health Administration's office of disability and medical assessment. "Some of our C-and-P clinics are quite small, … and it doesn't have much in the way of reasonable defense. We're very concerned about that."

Patricia Murray, the director of the VA's clinical program and administrative operations, said that to try to prevent any misunderstandings, the VA is removing the compensation-and-pension medical exam from a veteran's online health record until after a decision on his or her disability claim has been made.

"I think sometimes when they see [the medical records], they think the determination to grant [benefits] is solely based on the C-and-P file," she said, adding that "our examiners feel like they're sometimes at risk."

But some committee members were concerned about removing the compensation-and-pension exam records, but not other health documents, from the website.

"I hate to say this, but what is the ethical justification of removing the C-and-P exams from the Blue Button?" asked Michael Simberkoff, executive chief of staff at the VA's NY Harbor Healthcare System.

But department officials tied the move to one factor: Potential risk to VA staffers. In addition to changing when a veteran can see part of his or her file online, they are also considering adding extra security to the clinics, such as requiring a code to unlock doors.

"Many of the C-and-P docs are females, and they seem to be the ones that seem to have the evening hours or are in these far-flung [clinics]," said Denny Devine, the VA's project executive for disability and medical assessments. "Those are the ones on our weekly calls raising these concerns."

The VA received more than 1 million requests for disability exams during fiscal 2014. It has almost 527,500 pay and pension claims currently waiting to be decided, with more than 46 percent—or 244,727—waiting more than 125 days for a decision.

http://www.nationaljournal.com/defense/va-moves-to-prevent-veteran-violence-over-disability-claims-20141021

Edited October 21, 2014 by Opiate73 (see edit history)

[Stretch]

The only way a VA employee could be concerned about this is that if they have lied.

[Opiate73]

Concur, Stretch.

I was so taken back when I ran across and read this article. I think the only productive comment I can muster is.....seems like a knee jerk reaction, and hopefully our national vet reps raise the BS flag. I mean seriously, we deserve a little bit more credit than what the VA leadership is suggesting. SMH

Edited October 21, 2014 by Opiate73 (see edit history)

[Navy4life]

I am on the fence about this possible change. I had several C&P exams last July with a QTC facility and I have yet to see them. However I do know that I was S/C partially for some of the contentions I did go to those C&P's for.

Now a few weeks ago I went to my MH C&P exam for my Eating Disorder and PTSD (secondary to personal assault) and I was able to view that on MyHealthyVets. I am a little discouraged at it but glad I was able to view it. I know we are all anxious when and after we take them so I think the better route for the VA is to go ahead and try to complete the claim(s) as soon as they can after receiving the C&P....

I can see how a lot of Vet's get angry over reading them and I know for myself I am not a doctor so trying to figure out what they are saying or if they say something that is not true is upsetting even though the C&P examiner is only seeing us for the first time.

Maybe it is a good idea to not be able to view them but I don't think it makes a Vet so angry they would take it out on the C&P staff???? JMHO

[georgiapapa]

They should not be worried as long as they can logically explain why they rendered the opinions they did in the C & P exam reports. If they can not explain their opinions, they should not be conducting the exams.

The examiners should also make sure everything they put in a C & P exam report is accurate. It is not usual for veterans to get copies of their C & P exam reports and find omissions or inaccuracies regarding info which is important to their claims. Sometimes vets find comments made by the C & P examiner which gives the impression the veteran was not cooperatve during the exam when in fact the veteran could not perform certain tests due to their pain and/or limited ROM. Like Stretch said, sometimes the examiners lie in the reports. If they lie or intentionally sabotage a vet's C & P exam, they deserve to be in fear. JMO

[georgiapapa]

Typos are getting to be a regular thing with me. My fingers work faster than my nimble brain.

I should have stated "unusual" not "usual" in my post reply above.

Sorry...

[manning01]

I wonder if they are already doing it tonight. MyHealthy Vet is down for website maintenance this evening hummm.....

[Notorious Kelly]

I'm surprised more trained killers Don't get violent with the VA rather than cower over saying one wrong thing that could ruin their lives forever.

These people have good reason to fear.

But- there may be other reasons besides those given for blocking C&P results before decisions: vets are far more informed on the VA's shenanigans (thanks in no small part to forums like this one - Thanks, Tbird! ) and, seeing bogus conclusions in our C&Ps we submit a 21-4138 or otherwise call em on it before the decision is reached, rather than wait for bad news and lengthy appeals process while slipping into poverty and possibly homelessness.

This system is a travesty and it's good that they are afraid!

[Berta]

"Patricia Murray, the director of the VA's clinical program and administrative operations, said that to try to prevent any misunderstandings, the VA is removing the compensation-and-pension medical exam from a veteran's online health record until after a decision on his or her disability claim has been made."

That is ABSURD!

And that would be another violation of our rights.

They already prevent access if the exam is done by QTC until the claim is decided ( which is also a violation of our rights) and now they want to take away another right we have....?

Notorious Kelly is completely on the mark..........that is the real problem...... the VA knows many if not most C & P exams are bogus. My own C file has plenty of them.

The fact that many vets with and even without IM0s finally get decisions overturned based on these crap exams, is what the VA fears.....

and they know however that many vets, due to their disabilities , and lack of funds for IMOs , cannot fight back a quack opinion.

This crap is more VA spin to take the heat off VA for the real problems VA is having................

problems which will get worse.....

Edited October 22, 2014 by Berta (see edit history)

[justrluk]

The first few times we take them to task on this (e.g., contact Congressmen, Senators, Governors, etc.), we should raise a $hi* storm...

[63SIERRA]

That is not FAIR to the veteran, because we dont get a chance to have mistakes corrected before the claim is decided. AND THEY DO MAKE PLENTY MISTAKES!!!!!

[Gastone]

To Whom It May Concern: All it would take is ONE incidence of a VA C&P Clinician being assaulted by a Vet based on the Vets C&P to get the "Usual Suspects" panties in a Knot. If there are 500K+ C&P's waiting, using the 10% Rule, you have at least 50K Vets that might jump ugly after reading their C&P results on My Healthy Vet. You can kind of understand the VA's concern. Look at it from the C&P Clinicians point of view. Granted not all the military personnel are "Trained Killers" but unless things have changed, all Marines and all US Army combat arms personnel are exactly that, trained to kill. You have to understand the VA Clinician and by extension the VA's concern about the possibility of violence.

May 2014 I had a C&P for a SC secondary issue FDC. I realized before the exam, that the condition was more likely secondary to another SC condition than the one I claimed on the FDC. At the C&P, as the VA Staff Dr was completing his VA Rating Dept requested DBQ, I explained that I thought I was in error regarding the causative SC condition. We discussed the issue in great detail and he agreed with me. He explained that he was bound by the Rating Dept DBQ request to only address the issue I stated as the cause of my Secondary issue, which wasn't as we agreed, the cause. He was a VERY Helpful VA DR. After he thoroughly completed the VA Rating Dept's requested DBQ, I asked him to complete a DBQ regarding my claimed Secondary issue and the likelihood of it being caused by the mutually agreed upon SC condition. Per VA Reg, when a VA Dr is requested to complete a DBQ (other than Mental Health DBQ's) it must be complete at the time of request and a copy supplied to the vet. He complied with my request for the DBQ and placed a copy in my VA Med Recd. Within 3 months I was awarded SC as Secondary for the claimed issue as addressed in the second DBQ.

Will requesting a DBQ at the time of the C&P work every-time, probably not. Just another tool Vets can use if they choose to press the issue at the time of the C&P. If you don't try it, it will always be woulda, coulda and shoulda.

Semper Fi

Gastone

[knap-sack]

I recently went to the va for a diagnose after weeks waiting for an appointment and she would not give me one for both conditons. She gave me one but said the other she would need to see my SMR to see the surgery performed that resuilted in loss of motion in joint. She said on my way out that she believed the surgery caused lack of motion. Here is the kicker I wad in the same room for a c and p seven months ago. More hoops to jump through. MRI x-rays and now they want to see my Smr they had access to seven months ago. I probably sound a little irritated I am, I am going to walk them in and give them to the doc anf make an request for diagnose calmly. Because if I act irritated ot become a smart ass I will have to get an attorney and anguish for god knows how long and have to jump through what ever hoops they want to send me over which in return make me impossible to live with and I'll probably lose my lovely wife because I reacted like a normal human being, can't win for losing. I think I'll wslk in with my smr like a beaten down dog with my tail between my legs. Damn I feel more confident than ever about my future.

[Chuck75]

"She" sounds like an examiner. Anyway, the VAMC insurance/patient records should have a copy in your files. You have every legal right to see and obtain that information, once you fill out the form to do so.

[justrluk]

Transparency in the claims and healthcare process is the only way this system will improve. If we can't see the problems, we can't help fix them.

[Notorious Kelly]

Agreed- the VA is like the CIA in keeping incidents on campus hush-hush and no view into what's going on- this leads to mistrust and hostility.

Their fear of veterans is caused by their own outdated juggernaut condescending bureaucracy of inefficiency and waste.

I want streaming web cams on rater's areas to see that they are working. There is no excuse for the process length and delays causing grief to so many and undoubtedly more than a few deaths.

Is there even a non-violent solution to this? If there is, why isn't it being done.

[iceturkee]

guess i am in the minority here but i don't think you should see your c&p exam until after adjudication. my local va clinic stopped releasing early because vets were calling the examiners bitching about their notes. the time to bitch is later.

and truthfully i have been able to predict the outcome of my exams without seeing the notes. an astute person should be able to read the doctor, based on what he/she is asking and/or saying.

[Buck52]

I don't see how they can do this legally? Guess they have there own laws?

if they do, the Veteran can go to his VAMC and get copies of the C&P or any medical exam, I think everything the VA Does is in the computer, if its not there then how can they explain that in a federal court of law?

if there afraid that vets get mad and want to kick butt all they need to do is get security! probably some vet raised his voice at some medical exiamer and that is what bought this all about. its getting where all veterans are going to have to start listening very carefully to everything that is said to them during a C&P.

Maybe they just want to make the veteran even more pissed by doing this and make it harder to win him/her claim?

[broncovet]

No. More Good Vets are killed by a bad VA system, than bad vets killing VA employees. Its much much much safer to be a VA employee than to be a Veteran trying to get health care!!! FACT!!

Nobody says a thing anymore about the 22 vets per day that take their own life, and rarely ever talk about the VA killing at least 200 vets by making them wait months for an appointment, fraudunently, in JUST ONE VAMC. Remember, if fraud and corruption occurs in ONE VAMC it almost always occurs in more than one.

[Gastone]

Level of concern right now, I think Low. Just about everything the VA does is\governed by CFR in some way shape or form. I really haven't taken the time to check out the current regs regarding our access to our VA Med Records, DBQ's and clinician records either online or at the VAH Medical Records Dept. where I've Always been able to get everything I asked for.

Could be wrong but I don't think CFR's can be changed without some formal process. That's not to say a VARO or VAH employee wouldn't tell a Vet that policy regarding something has changed. If that's the case,so be it. In the past 5 years of contact with VA Hosp Empolyee's, that happened once. I told the VA Employee that "OK, but I want a copy of the Reg change before I left the appontment." Within a half hr she had changed her tune. Said she talked to her Supervisor and they were going to make an exception. I got what I was askinf for but never did get a copy of the aforementioned VA Reg Change.

Semper Fi

Gastone

[JR Reihs]

Ladies and Gents, this is another top reason to Never Ever go into a C&P exam without an IMO in hand or in file. You gotta shoot a rabid animal before it bites you, not after, and here the VA, after all these years are "skeerd" of us. Why now? Do they know something is going to change,or is there something else going on. This change raises more questions than the blanket answer that has been stated. Dealing with the VA, you need to go by the rule of boxing....Protect yourself at all times.