ptsd Ptsd Or Alzheimer's

[jessie0054]

OK, I have written several times in the last year about different member's of my family i am trying to help. Now it is my husband, He's doing some really out of charater things for him. Usually he is more in control, But lately i am seeing things in him that are starting to worry me.

First i'll tell you he is 30% service connected for PTSD. He ususally fuctions pretty well and these things have been coming on over the last 10-12 months and the lid blew off the pot so to speak today.

I collect coins as a hobby and in the last 4 months he has brought home a roll of the Washington quarters 4 times. I didn't have the heart to tell him i already have them so i just took them and put them away.

I keep his PM medications in the bathroom so he will not forget to take them as he go's through his bedtime routine. I have caught him twice in the last week taking them in the morning!!

A few times even though i have watched him take them he gets up 30 mins later " Oh i forgot to take my pills" So i have to remind him he's already taken them.

Twice in the last month or two he wakes me up out of a very peacefull sleep and ask me if i can't go take a sleeping pill so i can go to sleep. Duh!! I'm already sleeping!!

Somedays he will call me or our son half a dozen times a day and gets upset because we don't answer our cell phone saying ' I'm going to throw that SOB cell phone out the door because you won't answer it" Well i check it to see if i have missed any calls because sometime if i'm in another room and the TV is on i can't hear it ring and ususally no i haven't any missed calls from him.

Last Saturday he got up at 5:30 Am and got dressed and ready to head off to work. I woke up and ask him what he was doing, You don't work on Saturadys.!!

This morning he called me from work very upset, Said he had hid some money in the gargage and some of it was missing and accused me of taking it. [And no, I didn't know he was hidding money and no i didn't take his money!!]

He got even more upset when i ask why he was hidding money and could he maybe have put some of it in a different area and forgot where he hid it?? Boy that was the wrong thing to say!! I'm sure i haven't heard the end of it yet!!

Like i said he usually is in pretty good control and i'm hoping that in the next few hours before he gets off work that he may take sometime and think about the things he said. So maybe he will have cooled off before he gets home. I have never had a reason to fear him, But!!! He loves his money and if he really believes i took any from him i don't know what he might do.

So could be his PTSD getting worse or is he getting Alzhemer's disease??

Jessie

[jessie0054]

At his there are many things to consider. PTSD could be a factor and so could alzheimers. I don't think it's to early to test for alzheimers.

Another possibility is multi-infarct dementia. More likely in my opinion. It is close to alzheimers but not the same. It is multiple small infarcts (tiny strokes-bleeds-damaged areas) throughout the brain. Somewhat common as we age. Most often these cannot be seen on CT or MRI. Neuro-psych testing is often used to diagnose this and differentiate it from alzheimers.

Also, Mild Traumatic Brain Injury or Post Cuncusive Syndrom. Even a relatively minor cuncusion can cause this. More often a series of them. They are very often misdiagnosed because the symptoms do not become apparent for several months. Misdiagnoses for MTBI are PTSD, Depression, Anxiaty, Chronic fatigue dissorder and others. The most common being depression and/or PTSD.

Your story of your husband sounds just like me. I have MTBI. I get very angry when things are not as I remember (or don't remember) them. While I know at the time that this is my faulty brain connections, and am upset with myself, I still think those around me should know what I have difficulty with and end up projecting my frustration on to them. My poor wife gets some pretty good butt chewings out of the blue, with little warning.

Only a good Doc can seperate these possibilities. (there are more I'm unaware of I'm quite sure) Many times it's a neurologist and/or a neuropsychologist. But a good GP can usually get it right also.

Hope this helps.

Time

Thanks Time:

I was on the phone with both DR's yesterday and now have appointments set up for him next week. His Psych ask me if i was aware that he had missed all his appointment in this last year?? I had no idea!! I sent him out for those appointments and even ask him how they went and i always got the same answer " Just fine, Nothing to worry about" I guess i'll just have to make it a point to go with him!! I know he is going to hate that!

You have brought to light some conditions i never gave a thought to and will bring them up to the DR.

Thanks Again

Jessie

[Berta]

Great info from all here and yes- pay heed to what Wings posted- excellent info--

"Another possibility is multi-infarct dementia. More likely in my opinion. It is close to alzheimers but not the same. It is multiple small infarcts (tiny strokes-bleeds-damaged areas) throughout the brain. Somewhat common as we age. Most often these cannot be seen on CT or MRI. Neuro-psych testing is often used to diagnose this and differentiate it from alzheimers"

This is the best way to differentiate PTSD from Multi infarct dementia and also Alsheimer's or anything else-the tests can be done by VA and they take usually two days of testing.

They can involve 6-7 separate types of tests.

If a PTSD vet has a major memory loss- than maybe VA could say down the road that they no longer have the memories that were their stressors-

therefore they dont have PTSD-

I cant support that with any claim- just my VAola paranoia-

When my husband had a major stroke- he had short term memory loss-

he also had multi-infarct dementia and PTSD.

The tests revealed no personality disorder, short term memory loss, visual loss, limited cognitive impairment,lack of normal spatial and physical coordination, and yet still catastrophic levels of PTSD.

I have noticed many PTSD Vietnam combat vets seem to have memory problems.

But they never forget their stressors.

I think VA would like medical evidence however that would show they forgot

their stressors due to some other problem.

You might have to be forceful in getting VA to perform these tests or better yet, get them done independently,

because these types of Neurological and psychiatric tests are definitive as to extent of and presense of both physical brain trauma and emotional trauma of PTSD, anxiety, depression etc. and the results can separate all of these issues.

Edited August 22, 2007 by Berta

[Jay Johnson]

Jay, It's been awhile since I jumped into vets law, but from what I recall - deciding the "as likely as not" standard is in the realm of medical examiners. Your conclusion herein was "unlikely, but not impossible". ~Wings

See

"More likely than not" (meaning likelihood greater than 50%); "at least as likely as not" (meaning likelihood of at least 50%); or "less likely than not" or "unlikely" (meaning that there is a less than 50% likelihood).

The term "at least as likely as not" does not mean "within the realm of medical possibility." Rather, it means that the weight of medical evidence both for and against a conclusion is so evenly divided that it is as medically sound to find in favor of that conclusion as it is to find against it. http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:ln373x...;cd=5&gl=us

See also

Improving the Presumptive Disability Decision-Making Process for Veterans,

Status: Uncorrected Copy - Prepublication Available

Size: 985 pages, 6 x 9

Publication Year: 2007

http://books.nap.edu/catalog.php?record_id=11908

For the presumptive disability decision-making process, this Committee recommends categorizing the level of overall evidence for a causal relationship between exposure and health outcome in one of the following categories:

1. Sufficient: the evidence is sufficient to conclude that a causal relationship exists.

2. Equipoise and Above: the evidence is sufficient to conclude that a causal relationship is at least as likely as not, but not sufficient to conclude that a causal relationship exists.

3. Below Equipoise: the evidence is not sufficient to conclude that a causal relationship is at least as likely as not, or is not sufficient to make a scientifically informed judgment.

4. Against: the evidence suggests the lack of a causal relationship.

You seem to want to debate something for the sake of debate and you are trying to play semantics with my words as a means towards that end. The phrase you are quoting here was not meant to be taken as an official VA statement in case law; it was exactly as I stated, a MEDICAL *opinion*. The veteran in this thread did not ask whether or not she could SC the mental disorders, she asked whether or not it could be due to the veteran's PTSD.

However, if you want to continue this, then keep in mind that it won't matter either way in terms of the VA because the mental lapses would fall UNDER the PTSD, so it's a moot point. In other words, the veteran would need to put in for an increase in PTSD in general and there didn't appear to be evidence of that. I guess one could argue that a diminishing cognitive functioning ***if linked to the PTSD*** could warrant an increase in PTSD, which is why I said to pursue, but don't expect it.

[Jay Johnson]

Berta,

"Infarction" is just medical terminology for "death", so if there are multiple infarcts within one's brain it should be detectable via a brain MRI scan.

But, we can go around in circles for days debating all of the potential causes of memory loss(which could, in fact, be due to nothing more than typical loss as one ages, with no physiological cause). The best thing to do is keep a log of the "mental lapses" and sit down with the veteran with said log to show him, exactly, how bad his memory is (plus it will help in a diagnosis down the road). At that point *hopefully* he'll see the severity of the issue and go in for a battery of tests.....I wouldn't play up the alzheimers thing though, because it carries a negative connotation with most people and it may scare him out of seeking the medical testing he needs....just let him know that it could be due to many things, including diabetes, low iron, anxiety, etc, etc.......if you start throwing out brain death, strokes, alzheimers and other nasty things you may just scare him out of testing all together!

Edited August 22, 2007 by Jay Johnson

[Jay Johnson]

At his there are many things to consider. PTSD could be a factor and so could alzheimers. I don't think it's to early to test for alzheimers.

There's an eye blink test that can detect alzheimers very early on that I read in a study awhile back....I'll try to dig it up, but, in essence, it had to do with conditioned learning and showed memory issues far earlier than was previously detected by conventional alzheimer's testing means.....

I did some digging and here's a link that somewhat describes the rationale - Eye Blink Test. It's not the paper I was hoping to find, but it'll do I suppose:-)

[timetowinarace]

Berta is correct. It may be hard to get the VA to do the proper tests. The VA has NEVER evaluated nor treated me for my head injury with the exception of a couple of C&P exams and a neuro that treats my headaches. I provided the test results that the psych's used for the C&P's. And paid for it. I've practicaly begged to be treated for my cognative dissfunctions but to no responce untill recently. (today)

My tests revealed that my short and long term memory are fine. However, my working memory is very poor so that both short term and long term memory is affected. (The memories are there, my brain can't find them when I need them)

As far as this goes:

""Infarction" is just medical terminology for "death", so if there are multiple infarcts within one's brain it should be detectable via a brain MRI scan."

It's false information. I have multi-infarct dementia. While it is cell death, these are too small for modern day imaging to detect. My numerous CT's and MRI's show nothing. This is more often the case then not in multi-infarct dementia.

Please don't post misleading information. Someone may choose not to pursue a possibilty and get the help they need.

Time