Recent Voc Rehab Experience

[P31415926]

Looking back on my experience raises questions.

50% SC, 47 y/o Serious Employment Handicap, offered by ch 31 to attend a school 30 mi away for a professional cert. I moved to the county where school is located, rent + ut increases to $950 from $600. I slowly bleed my savings to pay for this while living in poverty. I also take out $1800 in student loans. Oh btw, no laptop, printer, etc like some think is guaranteed. My laptop request including email from teacher regarding computer classwork was refused.

Finished cert in one year, no jobs in this field. School books are 3 years old which made it impossible to even practice the work, so the gov't didn't even get what they paid for, let alone the student. The material was outdated bigtime.

Summary: I still have the employment handicap, I'm out over $4k, student loans have come due, not qualified in this field, now taking a job as entry level ____ to survive. I'm worse off than before I started the program. They switched my case manager in the middle of the school year to one 200 miles away and out of state - who has a less than stellar record of answering phone calls or emails.

I don't think this was the rehabilitation that was intended- what happened here? They are itching to close out my file as soon as I take any low end job - is that it? Am I done?

I'm trying to keep a positive attitude while the ch 31 people are playing some kind of poker game, not showing their hand or the opportunities available. Thanks

[P31415926]

Nice try Rick, but I didn't joing this forum to make stuff up, just to find out if I had a chance for a do-over since the first year was such a waste of time and $. You find stories hard to believe because the VA is such a benevolent organization?

Your sweeping generalization that the VA always pays the total cost of ch 31 is blatantly false. How do you define total? Define always. I had to pay an item on the school bill (invoice) because my case manager ignored me whe I told him about the charge. He ordered me to "stop loking at the bill! I'll take care of it." Sure enough the charge I warned him about wasn't covered and I had to pay $90 to the school where he could've had it waived when I told him about it. He never apologized.

Do most folks live with their parents to save rent? Are most students homeless to save on rent and all the costs associated wth an apartment in an expensive city? Is gas, car insurance and car repair free for most of voc rehab students? If I fasted for four months, wouldn't have to spend a dime on food. I could wreck my credit by not paying those miscellaneous unexpected costs that spring up for all of us from time to time.

Do some adding up here, try to live on a $700 + stipend of $488 which is a month late and chopped for partial months. Worthwhile sacrifice for a good program, I totally agree. That's what I thought I was doing. but.........

If they're so good about not offering programs with jobs in our area, why am I in this situation? A look at my file will show that your statement makes no sense. If you perhaps had some statistics to show the VA is "real good about not letting..."

The VA gets away with what they do because they have people who don't fight back for various reasons such as mental ilness or possibly worn down from the constant refusal and rejection to their requests. Or they hide from you what opportunities are available. They do some great things, I have had great care from their medical system, etc. This whole thing started out as a question - am I finished with voc rehab even though no specific employment goals were met? On paper they can close out the file.

I'm happy for you guys who had a positive experience in voc rehab - right on.

[P31415926]

I see how that would help you, 1968. I blindly went through a course for a one year worthless professional certificate in a certain vocation that has no jobs. So, technicaly, I did complete a program of study under ch 31. I have the paper. No help for TDIU.

But wasn't the point to help a vet get back into the skilled workplace? Objective not accomplished.

In agreement with a lot of you, it is indeed a very good program and now I see that success is dependent on an informed veteran and a knowledgeable, caring case manager. I was not and had neither. It's probably a small percentage who have a beef with the system on this particular subject. YMMV

If I take this entry level factory job after three years out of work, will the VA deem me "cured."?

[AB2WK]

When someone sitting behind a desk at Voc Rehab doesn't do thier job it affects a lot of people. They forget or just don't care that there are real people with families depending on them to do what they are getting paid to do. I was lucky by having some reallly caring people moving me through the system. I ended up in the independant living program since no one is going to hire someone with ms and osteoporosis. They helped me to develop my hobbies (ham radio) by getting some nice equipment for me to use. It sound like the guy you were dealing with was just some chump collecting a undeserved paycheck.

[cowgirl]

1968. A written statement like that is gold, did they 'disconnect' you from your 'regular' work? For instance my military training doesnt transfer into civilian work. I wanted to get trained for another job but longstoryshort, well paid VA counselor paper pushed me through the door. With mdd, I was intimidated, so at that time vocab rehab wasnt for me. Wonder if I tried again how to get written statement, any clues? thanks. humbly,cg

My VA Voc Rehab denied services to me, in witing, because of my mental disabilities. I wanted their written statement, and they gave it to me. Yes, it will help if you are going for TDIU.

[Guest rickb054]

Nice try Rick, but I didn't joing this forum to make stuff up, just to find out if I had a chance for a do-over since the first year was such a waste of time and $. You find stories hard to believe because the VA is such a benevolent organization?

I did not say you made anything up, I said I find your story hard to believe. Benevolent...no... but i've been through the voc rehab process three times and based on my experience with the program and that of many other vets I know, no one has ever paid a penny out of pocket for voc rehab and regardless of what you say no one ever will.

Your sweeping generalization that the VA always pays the total cost of ch 31 is blatantly false. How do you define total? Define always.

I define total as all authorized books and materials. Always is every time a veteran attends an approved course.

I had to pay an item on the school bill (invoice) because my case manager ignored me whe I told him about the charge. He ordered me to "stop loking at the bill! I'll take care of it." Sure enough the charge I warned him about wasn't covered and I had to pay $90 to the school where he could've had it waived when I told him about it. He never apologized.

It wasn't covered because you did not get prior approval that is you fault not the systems, maybe he could of waived the charge, that is your opinion but we will never know.

Do most folks live with their parents to save rent? Are most students homeless to save on rent and all the costs associated wth an apartment in an expensive city? Is gas, car insurance and car repair free for most of voc rehab students? If I fasted for four months, wouldn't have to spend a dime on food. I could wreck my credit by not paying those miscellaneous unexpected costs that spring up for all of us from time to time.

Now what you are asking for is free room, food, and transportation..get real vocational rehabilitation does not promise to cover all your living expences and you knew that when you signed up. May veterans drop out of the program because of the cost of living, you had the same option. Sorry, but sounds like you wanted a free ride in addition to vocational rehabilitation, and that is not what the program is about.

Do some adding up here, try to live on a $700 + stipend of $488 which is a month late and chopped for partial months. Worthwhile sacrifice for a good program, I totally agree. That's what I thought I was doing. but.........

You knew what you were getting into. You agreeded to the program, and likey request some changes to it before agreeing in writing to it. You also knew upfront what your stipend was going to be. If you did not have the finances to carry you over, you had the option to work part time like every other veteran ( including me) to earn additional funds to get over the hump.

If they're so good about not offering programs with jobs in our area, why am I in this situation? A look at my file will show that your statement makes no sense. If you perhaps had some statistics to show the VA is "real good about not letting..."

It seems to me that you may have gone to school in a different area than from where you want to reside, if that is the case then that is your fault. The va has strict rules of not enrolling veterans into a course of instruction for a career that has no jobs in the immediate area. To do otherwise defeats the purpose of allowing a veteran to attend school. You need to Use some common sence.

The VA gets away with what they do because they have people who don't fight back for various reasons such as mental ilness or possibly worn down from the constant refusal and rejection to their requests. Or they hide from you what opportunities are available. They do some great things, I have had great care from their medical system, etc. This whole thing started out as a question - am I finished with voc rehab even though no specific employment goals were met? On paper they can close out the file.

The va has to follows rules, regulations, and laws just like you or me. If they get over it is because someone allowed them to get over. The va does not hide anything, but you have to know what you want and ask the right question. VA personnel are not perfect they make mistakes, and you may have to challenge them untill they can show you why you are wrong.

I'm happy for you guys who had a positive experience in voc rehab - right on.

I'm not saying all veterans have a positive experience, fact is my last voc rehab experience was terrible. VA personnel make mistakes, but it seems to me that you are complaining about not getting something that was never offered to begin with, and that you did not follow the rules to get the total benefit of what was offer to you.

I know these are not the answers you wanted but that is life. When a veteran is right I will support him, when he is wrong I will tell him he is wrong its just that simple.

[sixthscents]

I'm going to have to agree with Rickb054 on this one. While the program is not perfect, it is a HUGE benefit for our newly discharged veterans as well as our older ones seeking to get back into the workforce. Nothing is EVER perfect, and a veterans Voc Rehab experience often depends upon their case manager - BUT isn't that the same no matter VA or not? Isn't that the same no matter WHAT program, or who is administering it?

Voc Rehab is NOT meant to pay for all the costs of living. Most scholarships do not either... as well as the Dept. of Labor's program, or the Social Security "ticket to work" program. Voc Rehab SHOULD pay for all the normal costs associated with attending a college or training program approved by them... with a stipend to cover fuel, and transportation expenses...

Complaining about some $90 charge when the program probably shuffled out thousands and thousands of dollars seems somewhat petty. No the program isn't perfect, but it is an enourmous benefit to veterans of all catagories. It has helped a great many veterans re-enter the workforce. If the training a person receives does not qualify them for a job in their local area, whos fault is that? The Voc Rehab process is two-ways. So every veteran has SOME say in their vocational path. If for some reason, after training their isnt a way to get a job in your vocational area, whos fault is that? It is certainly NOT the Voc Rehab councilors, since the veteran helps CHOOSE the career path.

I'm sorry P31415926, but your complaints seem rather inconsequential. As Rick said. Every veteran knows what they are getting into when they enter the program... they give out phamplets as well as conducting face-to-face interviews that tell all about the program and what it will, and will not pay for. I have looked at all the "other" voc rehab programs offered by other agencies like the Dept. of Labor, and Social Security, and the VA's is by far the best. Again, in ANY of these programs, SOME of the positive or negative impact will be because of the councilor, but by and large I think that the VAST majority of people who have been involved in VA's Voc Rehab would say it was great.

I went to college and worked a full-time job. I had a scholarship, and my GI-Bill, but it only covered the cost of school, not living. I can remember selling my books early, so we'd have enough money to pay the rent. I just cant comprehend complaining about something like this... At any time you could have requested anothe councilor, or argued for another degree path... Nope. Honestly your entire argument makes you sound like you expected them to do everything, pay for everything, and then find you a job afterward.....

(sigh).... most student HAVE to work when they go to school or take out loans. Thats just they way things are. The average college student leaves owing student loans... I did, even with all the work and help. The last of them were finally discharged because of my disability but I paid them back for YEARS prior. Nope, I'm sorry guy, but it seems to me like you are complaining instead of commenting.