Can You Be Rated At 100% Comp And Still Have Be

[jecsb4]

All,

I have a question that I don't remember comming across. Can you be rated 100% by the VA and still allowed to have a job? Or do they expect you to not work, because you are rated at 100%

I am not sure what the other issues arise with 100% such as IU.

Thanks,

Joe

[timetowinarace]

100% for mental means you are incompetent, how can you work if your incompetent

100 %

Total occupational and social impairment, due to such symptoms as: gross impairment in thought processes or communication; persistent delusions or hallucinations; grossly inappropriate behavior; persistent danger of hurting self or others; intermittent inability to perform activities of daily living (including maintenance of minimal personal hygiene); disorientation to time or place; memory loss for names of close relatives, own occupation, or own name

Where in there is the word incompetent? It isn't.

First, I find your comment ignorant, both stereotypicaly and by U.S. Code.

Second I'll tell you why.

Look up 38 CFR 3.353

For VA purposes, a mentally incompetent person is defined as one who, because of injury or disease, lacks the mental capacity to control or manage his or her own affairs, including disburment of funds without limitation. No where in the rating scheduale for mental dissorders are those words used. Maybe you should define your use of the word.

Most veterans rated at 100% for mental disorders ARE NOT found to be incompetent. On the other end, a person with a 40% disability can be found incompetent. Disability percentage and VA Competency are not related in ANY way.

As for whether or not a person can be employed with this rating, yes but just like back pain, if you claim that you cannot lift more than a few pounds but have a job siding houses it doesn't add up. With my 3rd percentile verbal fluency, I'd have a hard time explaining a job at a call center (or any custommer service). But a person with anxiaty and depression may get by spending some time in the back room of a small engine repair shop.

IU is a definate no for any rating.

Time

[Jay Johnson]

You all seem to be missing the point here, so I'll break it down:

Let's first define occupational....what does this mean??? It means WORK, EMPLOYMNET, JOB, ETC.

Now, let's define social.....what does this mean??? Your social life...how you interact with others, your family life, etc.

Ok, but what does total mean?.....

1) Of, relating to, or constituting the whole; entire. See Synonyms at whole.

2) Complete; utter; absolute: total concentration; a total effort; a total fool.

Ok, so one must be completely, utterly and wholly occupationally disabled to be 100% (let's remember now, occupational = work) AND one must ALSO be completely, utterly and wholly socially disabled to be 100% (what does social mean again boys and girls?...ding ding ding...your social life).

So, in all seriousness, one CANNOT work while having a mental disorder rated at 100% and it is quite difficult to work with a mental disorder at 70% because the requirement for that is "severe" occupational disability (if one is severely occupationally disabled they really shouldn't be working).

Now, you can argue that this standard is wrong and bias (and it certainly is), but that doesn't change the FACT that this *IS* VA law and one cannot work, at 100%, with a severe mental disability.

[timetowinarace]

Your definitions are correct.

However, all ratings are assigned as the percentage the AVERAGE person would be affected by the injury or disease.

If a person is assigned the seventy percent rating that the average person would get for the severity of that same injury/disease but cannot work because it effects them worse than the average person, that is where IU comes in.

At the other end, the person with the same condition, (except rated at the 100% rating that the average person with that severity of injury/illness) can overcome their situation over the average person; then they are not considered less disabled. They are above average individuals. They cannot be punished for being successfull despite their disability.

100% is Total occupational impairment whether physical or mental. What physical impairments are there that are rated at 100% that are considered less than total for the average person?

I don't have time to look it up, but this IS in CFR 38.

Average is average. We are not all the same, with the same abilities to perform in our own situations.

I suppose I could quote the definition of Average for us boys and girls.

Only IU and SSDI are based upon actuall unemployability. The VA is C&P. Compensation and Pension. While it is widely considered disability, we recieve compensation.

Time

Edited June 16, 2007 by timetowinarace

[john999]

I believe that if you lost both legs in the military you would get a 100% rating but you could still work if you could find a job. The former secretary of the VA lost both legs and an arm. 70-100 percent ratings for vets with an emotional/mental impairment are treated differently. This to me is unfair but being able to work is an essential part of your GAF score. I think mental disorders are still considered some kind of charcter defect by the VA. If it is a chemical imbalance then it is a physical illness like diabetes. The first thing they will ask you at your C&P exam for a mental problem is "are you working?".

[Jay Johnson]

How 'bout you find a ratings guideline for a physical disability that requires a "total" occupational disability? And where did you get this nonsense about averages?

Heck, the recent independent review that the VA commissioned stated that it is unfair that mental disabilities are rated solely on one's ability to work (as opposed to physical disabilities which take into account quality of life issues).

One can be "totally disabled" without being totally "occupationally" disabled. Only mentally disabled vets are held to that standard.

[timetowinarace]

38 C.F.R. 4.1 Essentials of evaluative rating.

This rating schedule is primarily a guide in the evaluation of disability resulting from all types of diseases and injuries encountered as a result of or incident to military service. The percentage ratings represent as far as can practicably be determined the average impairment in earning capacity resulting from such diseases and injuries and their residual conditions in civil occupations. Generally, the degrees of disability specified are considered adequate to compensate for considerable loss of working time from exacerbation's or illnesses proportionate to the severity of the several grades of disability. For the application of this schedule, accurate and fully descriptive medical examinations are required, with emphasis upon the limitation of activity imposed by the disabling condition. Over a period of many years, a veteran's disability claim may require re ratings in accordance with changes in laws, medical knowledge and his or her physical or mental condition. It is thus essential, both in the examination and in the evaluation of disability, that each disability be viewed in relation to its history.

[41 FR 11292, Mar. 18, 1976]

Highlights in red are mine.

Ummmm, THIS is where I got the nonsence about averages.

This is where it says beniffits are for compensation. Do I need to find the definition for 'compensation'.

Physical or mental conditions are NOT seperated

Sec. 4.15 Total disability ratings.

The ability to overcome the handicap of disability varies widely

among individuals. The rating, however, is based primarily upon the

average impairment in earning capacity, that is, upon the economic or

industrial handicap which must be overcome and not from individual

success in overcoming it. However, full consideration must be given to

unusual physical or mental effects in individual cases, to peculiar

effects of occupational activities, to defects in physical or mental

endowment preventing the usual amount of success in overcoming the

handicap of disability and to the effect of combinations of disability.

Total disability will be considered to exist when there is present any

impairment of mind or body which is sufficient to render it impossible

for the average person to follow a substantially gainful occupation;

Provided, That permanent total disability shall be taken to exist when

the impairment is reasonably certain to continue throughout the life of

the disabled person. The following will be considered to be permanent

total disability: the permanent loss of the use of both hands, or of

both feet, or of one hand and one foot, or of the sight of both eyes, or

becoming permanently helpless or permanently bedridden. Other total

disability ratings are scheduled in the various bodily systems of this

schedule.

There is more to the schedual of ratings than what percentages for what injuries/diseases. Reading the whole thing might help. I already have. A few times.

Oh, then there are the veterans with 100% ratings under the schedual for ratings for mental disabilities that are working. One of which posted earlier.

1. My nonsence about averages happens to be Law.

2. "How 'bout you find a ratings guideline for a physical disability that requires a "total" occupational disability?"

The guidelines are clear. Total disability will be considered to exist when there is present any

impairment of mind or body which is sufficient to render it impossible

for the average person to follow a substantially gainful occupation

3. "One can be "totally disabled" without being totally "occupationally" disabled. Only mentally disabled vets are held to that standard."

Now you show me where it says that.

Time

Edited June 17, 2007 by timetowinarace