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Is This Right, Can They Do This?

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RockyA1911

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Hey all,

I made my third trip to the VAMC today, the 5th of Jan 06. The Dr. was supposed to go over the results and discuss it with me. My first trip there was on 9 Dec 05 for a NP evaluation, but the Dr. spent all of the time that day talking to me and obtaining medical history. She did not have any of my records. So, I was set up with another appointment on the 21st of Dec 05 and that is when I took the all day tests, and it took all day.

Today the Dr. told me that she wanted me to come back and redo the true and false question test (370 questions) and also a two page multiple choice questionaire (This looked like the same questionaire they used for PTSD). She said that the results from this test in her opinion does not represent me and that if she turned in the results it would appear text book faking or lying. She said as she put it that my scores on these test in relation to the sickest of patients that it showed I am sicker than the sickest.

Oh! I wanted to add the test I am to retake is called the MMPI? It's all simply true and false, 370 of them short 3 to 4 word questions.

I did not lie or fake answers on any of the tests, I had never seen a lot of this silly stuff before. She said that since I suffered the head injury on the left side of my head all the problems seem to be from the right side of my head which is unusual and that the left side of my brain is functioning normally, but not the right side that wasn't injured.

I agreed to come back and retake the tests on the 19th of Jan 06. I was seeking an increase above the 10% I was awarded back in 1977 under Post Concussion Residuals. I had a compound depressed skull fracture with skull loss both inner and outer measuring 4.5 x 4.5 cm (larger than a 50 cent piece), along with brain debridement, and a cranioplasty during the same while in service injury and the same surgery performed by Great Lakes Naval Hospital while I was active duty in the Marine Corps. (I also have a claim in for the Skull Loss w/hernia and PTSD in addition to the increase for cognitive disorder.)

After having second thoughts I wonder now should I have just told her to submit the tests as they are because I did not fake or lie about anything and just cast my fate to the wind as to whether the RO want to think I was faking or something based on her text book fake test sheet or something like that. She said if the injury that happened to me in 1972 had happened today that I would indeed be receiving more than 10%.

What do you think? Is it ok to go ahead and retake the 2 tests or tell them to leave it as is? Is the VAMC allowed to do things like this, I mean keep having you come back again and again and redo the same tests?

The C&P MD that did my exam last July referred me to this physcologist because the C&P MD diagnosed me with a cognitive disorder and stated the cognitive disorder and memory loss is more than likely attributed to SC traumatic brain injury. Recommended a full neurophyscological exam to evaluate just how much this impacts his daily living. And that is why I am seeing this neurophyscologist.

Meanwhile back at the ranch. The VARO sent me a letter stating they would be making a decision on my other issues within 60 days now. PTSD, Skull Loss w/brain hernia, disfiguring surgical scar on head. The Skull Loss claim was originally filed on the same form back in 1976 and it just wasn't mentioned at all in the rating when they awarded me 10% for post concussion residuals due to brain trauma and that is the max allowed. The Skull Loss is in all the same C&P exam reports and was even mentioned in several of the VA doctors reports, even in the RO decision document, but at the bottom of it there was only 10% awarded for the post concussion residuals due to brain trauma. Yeah, I am asking for back pay. My current open claims are dated 25Mar05 so it's going on a year from filing date so far.

The C&P exam report from last July reported in AXIS I: 1. PTSD, chronic. 2. Cognitive disorder, not otherwise specified, 3. Depression, not otherwise specified

and a GAF of 52.

Edited by RockyA1911
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  • HadIt.com Elder

They had me re-take them, does it mean it's legal I don;t know but I did it, I am the one that wanted to get SC refusing to take it again may hurt your claim. On this one I don't really know the legality.

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"The Skull Loss claim was originally filed on the same form back in 1976 and it just wasn't mentioned at all in the rating when they awarded me 10% for post concussion residuals due to brain trauma and that is the max allowed. The Skull Loss is in all the same C&P exam reports and was even mentioned in several of the VA doctors reports, even in the RO decision document, but at the bottom of it there was only 10% awarded for the post concussion residuals due to brain trauma. Yeah, I am asking for back pay. "

IF THIS SEPARATE ISSUE WAS NOT ADDRESSED PROPERLY BY THE VARO IN 1976

WOULDN'T THIS STILL BE CONSIDERED AN OPEN AND PENDING CLAIM ? ? ?

I also have a few issues never decided upon from the mid 1970's.

carlie

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Hey all,

I made my third trip to the VAMC today, the 5th of Jan 06. The Dr. was supposed to go over the results and discuss it with me. My first trip there was on 9 Dec 05 for a NP evaluation, but the Dr. spent all of the time that day talking to me and obtaining medical history. She did not have any of my records. So, I was set up with another appointment on the 21st of Dec 05 and that is when I took the all day tests, and it took all day.

Today the Dr. told me that she wanted me to come back and redo the true and false question test (370 questions) and also a two page multiple choice questionaire (This looked like the same questionaire they used for PTSD). She said that the results from this test in her opinion does not represent me and that if she turned in the results it would appear text book faking or lying. She said as she put it that my scores on these test in relation to the sickest of patients that it showed I am sicker than the sickest.

Oh! I wanted to add the test I am to retake is called the MMPI? It's all simply true and false, 370 of them short 3 to 4 word questions.

I did not lie or fake answers on any of the tests, I had never seen a lot of this silly stuff before. She said that since I suffered the head injury on the left side of my head all the problems seem to be from the right side of my head which is unusual and that the left side of my brain is functioning normally, but not the right side that wasn't injured.

I agreed to come back and retake the tests on the 19th of Jan 06. I was seeking an increase above the 10% I was awarded back in 1977 under Post Concussion Residuals. I had a compound depressed skull fracture with skull loss both inner and outer measuring 4.5 x 4.5 cm (larger than a 50 cent piece), along with brain debridement, and a cranioplasty during the same while in service injury and the same surgery performed by Great Lakes Naval Hospital while I was active duty in the Marine Corps. (I also have a claim in for the Skull Loss w/hernia and PTSD in addition to the increase for cognitive disorder.)

After having second thoughts I wonder now should I have just told her to submit the tests as they are because I did not fake or lie about anything and just cast my fate to the wind as to whether the RO want to think I was faking or something based on her text book fake test sheet or something like that. She said if the injury that happened to me in 1972 had happened today that I would indeed be receiving more than 10%.

What do you think? Is it ok to go ahead and retake the 2 tests or tell them to leave it as is? Is the VAMC allowed to do things like this, I mean keep having you come back again and again and redo the same tests?

The C&P MD that did my exam last July referred me to this physcologist because the C&P MD diagnosed me with a cognitive disorder and stated the cognitive disorder and memory loss is more than likely attributed to SC traumatic brain injury. Recommended a full neurophyscological exam to evaluate just how much this impacts his daily living. And that is why I am seeing this neurophyscologist.

Meanwhile back at the ranch. The VARO sent me a letter stating they would be making a decision on my other issues within 60 days now. PTSD, Skull Loss w/brain hernia, disfiguring surgical scar on head. The Skull Loss claim was originally filed on the same form back in 1976 and it just wasn't mentioned at all in the rating when they awarded me 10% for post concussion residuals due to brain trauma and that is the max allowed. The Skull Loss is in all the same C&P exam reports and was even mentioned in several of the VA doctors reports, even in the RO decision document, but at the bottom of it there was only 10% awarded for the post concussion residuals due to brain trauma. Yeah, I am asking for back pay. My current open claims are dated 25Mar05 so it's going on a year from filing date so far.

The C&P exam report from last July reported in AXIS I: 1. PTSD, chronic. 2. Cognitive disorder, not otherwise specified, 3. Depression, not otherwise specified

and a GAF of 52.

Rocky- hope others give opinions here-

I would however- get copy of and submit that initial test myself if I were you-

MMPIs -I worked for a shrink years ago and had to moniter a MMPI test-

the shrink told me the patient was trying to fake some of his problems (to stay in a state psychiatric ward)yet the MMPI would clearly reveal his actual mental/emotional status-

I have a feeling that since :

"referred me to this physcologist because the C&P MD diagnosed me with a cognitive disorder and stated the cognitive disorder "

she might have somehow lost her results/ from the MMPI or misinterpreted already-

or another point- only a Psychiatrist and Neurologist can really opine on this:

"She said that since I suffered the head injury on the left side of my head all the problems seem to be from the right side of my head which is unusual and that the left side of my brain is functioning normally, but not the right side that wasn't injured." She is correct -this is unusual but same MRI picture my husband presented with a brain stem stroke-

It would be easy for VA to try to rule against left side residuals if the left side of brain-in her words- seems to be functioning normally-

As a psychologist-she is not an MD and cannot really make this kind of medical judgement herself-

she also is not qualified to prescribe meds so cannot really opine how those affect you too-

Also the VA can separate cognitive functioning from PTSD pr any other mental status but it could take motre than the MMPI- they gave my husband 6-7 tests for that- and a psychiatrist ran these tests.

Trails Mosing Test , Wechsler, Hand Test , MMPI, put the cube in the box, etc, a whole shibang-

He had 100 % PTSD and considerable brain deficits from stroke, that they could separate from the PTSD.

If you have statements in your med recs from Neurologists and/or psychiatrists-that help your claim, this should outweigh anything negative about her opinion-

If you have a copy and it helps-I dont see why you need to have an additional MMPI.

What do you all think men and women?

Maybe Ricky should show up for the appointment but make it clear to the shrink here that he has submitted her findings already-

sounds like she is trying to play the shell game if you catch my drift-or really screwed up something she doesnt want VA to know.

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  • HadIt.com Elder

Rocky

If you take any other these tests again just answer truthfully. Don't hold anything back and just tell it like it is. Maybe they want to see if the two tests come out the same.

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John,

I answered the questions in the MMPI truthfully the first time as to how I felt, but the VAMC Staff Neuropsychologist said that she didn't want to submit it because it would hurt me and she didn't feel that the first test represented me in her opinion.

Berta,

She is a a VA Neuropsychologist that finished her VA training and began working at the VA as a Staff Neuropsychologist in December of 05 so she is new there and I think I am either her 3rd or 4th patient. She has worked in private practice prior to the VA for a number of years and appears to be about 40 something.

I did have a IMO from a Psychiatrist that included both PTSD and open head injury and associated problems caused by the traumatic brain injury. It was submitted with my claim. The private Psychiatrist was also a Armybattalion surgeon in Vietnam in '68. He did subscribe me two medications and also stated in addition to PTSD that I was unemployable due to my condition. So I have that along with the MD from the C&P exam giving me the same GAF as the private psychiatrist did but she also added in addition to chronic PTSD, Depression, and Cognitive Disorder. That was back in July 05.

Does this neuropsychological opinion based on batteries of test scores carry more weight than the private and VAMC C&P doctors that are actual MDs?

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  • HadIt.com Elder

which one has more wieght? The one the VARO decides to put on it, they will pick and choose the one they want, then if you do not agree with their rating of your claim, you file a NOD or ask for a De Novo Review, or appeal it straight to BVA, then BVA might remand it and ask for another C&P or another opinion or they can grant the claim. I think the RO's pass the buck to BVA and let them grant the awards, then it can't be blamed on them. Some people claim it is the fault of the claimant for not supplying enough evidence, I know for a fact that the VARO refused to even address the issue of my stroke and they have had evidence of it for over 3 years I just had a C&P exam for it last week, they "discovered" new evidence, what new evidence, it's all date stamped in 2002 and 2003. I have been appealing it ever since, once they tried to tell me I had missed an appeal date and it was closed, they were shocked to see I had my date stamped copy to show the day I fioled the appeal, they had to pull the file back out. It's worth the trip to the VARO and hand it to them and get the date stamped copy handed back to you. Just don't lose it.

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