free_spirit_etc

He was 20% -- but not connected. That was for his knee. He also has some 0% SC's but I don't see any connections on those either -- Scars, hearing, and such... Free

All the tangles in the claim will effect what is the effective date of the claim. He honestly believed that he had appealed as needed in 2004 - since the letter he got said "Your appeal has been sent to the Board of Appeals" and his phone call to the RO in June 2006 - they didn't tell him the case was closed -- they just told him to send his additional evidence in and it would be sent to the BVA. But he apparently didn't send in the V-9 form - since they sent him a letter that said "You appeal has been sent to the Board." He thought he had done everything neccessary. The BVA makes this all very confusing - because of all the remands. He applied -- he appealed - and then they bounced things back and forth between the RO and BVA for YEARS without him ever having to send in anything else. And so it gets hard to determine which letters from the RO mean what. And when they just say "your appeal has been sent to the Board.." and don't tell you WHICH appeal - how are you supposed to know what part of your claim they are reviewing this time. He sure didn't think it was the dental claim that he had appealed in 1999 that was being sent to the Board in 2004. He had just got his supplemental statement of case on the Cancer a few weeks earlier -- and that was the only ACTIVE appeal he thought he had. So - the bite is - is he had KNOWN that wasn't the appeal they sent -- he wouldn't have WAITED for 2 years -- waiting for his cancer claim to be heard. So that is the pain about the VA taking so long to do things. The vets expect to wait a couple of years..so they don't even know when something is wrong. So they sent him a denial. He appealed. They sent him a letter saying he could have a Decision Review Offcier review the case - and if he did not choose to have the DRO look at his case - his case would follow the traditional appeal (i.e. BVA) process. He did NOT choose to have a DRO review -- but they did it anyway (basically copied and pasted the initial denial). Then they sent the SSOC -- and then they sent a letter that his appeal was being sent to the Board. So he THOUGHT his case was in the BVA line-up for two years. And even when he called the RO in 2006 - they never notified him it was closed. They told him to just send the additional evidence to send on to the BVA. The only way he found out it had been closed is that they informed the Senator that it had. After that- he sent a letter - telling them he had heard it had been closed - informing them that he thought it was on appeal - and asking to be informed of the status of his case - was it open or closed, and if it was closed - when and why was it closed. They have never responded to his written request. Wouldn't you think that the VA could tell you if your case was open or closed in within 7 months of your request? So along with your idea for the Bill for the Senate. It would be GREAT if the VA was required to tell you when they close your case -- so vets don't sit there for 2 years thinking their case is at the BVA - when it isn't. But when all they do is send form letters -- and cut and paste things..and half of their letters don't mean anything...how is the vet supposed to know which letters mean something and which ones don't. And which parts of the letter mean something and which parts don't. My husband had lots of letters with appeal forms attached. But he never had to fill them out and his case still went back and forth to the RO and BVA. As I read the regs -- apparently this was because he had filled out the ONE appeal form to cover all of them a long time before - so he didn't have to appeal all the SSOC to keep the appeals going. They had developed a lofe of their own. And as this was a different part of the claim (claimed in 2001) -- it was different. But he didn't know that -- especially as he got the letter that his appeal was sent to the Board. So it would be nice if they were a bit more clear - since different parts of your claim are in different stages of the process. And actually - if the claim was closed - we don't know if it was because of the cancer claim (filed in 2001) or the re-opened Desert Storm claim (re-opened in 2003). He did not appeal the decision on that - even with a NOD. But again -- it would be nice for a Bill that required the VA to notify you when they close your claim --- so you don't wait 2 years thinking everything is okay and THEN be TOLD everything is okay -- and then have a senator tell you it is NOT okay - but still not have the VA inform you of the status of your claim at your written request. If you were informed that the case was closed - you would be able to take immediate action to resolve it - and not lose 2 years of benefits during your wait time. Actually - along with his request to know the status of his claim - my husband sent in a NOD -- disagreeing with any decision that may have been made to close his claim - re-iterating that he was under the impression his claim had been sent to the BVA because of the Notice. So I think that is still a pending issue, as they did not respond to it. Also - it would be nice if the VA was required to inform you which PART of your claim was sent to the BVA - if the claim is separated out into different issues -- wouldn't it be great if they were required to add ONE WORD -- and say "Your CANCER claim has been sent to the Board" or "Your DENTAL claim has been sent to the Board" etc. so the veteran would know WHICH claim had been sent!! So again - they don't wait thinking that something has been sent when it hasn't. Free

I am not sure if they have me fully established or not. I reportd his death by phone - and sent in a copy of his death certificate, our marriage license, and my letter of office as executor. So they do have the documents. But who knows what they did with them. They seem to be able to respond really quickly to reports of death. But other stuff sure takes awhile. Our marriage license was in the same envelope as his death certificate - but then that might be handled by a whole different department. And then the lady at the RO who took my call and said I could keep the payment might have thought I was already on his record as the spouse for years. I am resending the marriage license and death certificate with my DIC claim. So I will probably not get the $225 - as they will hold the decision on that until they make the decision on the DIC years down the road. And maybe I will get it then - and maybe not. The law says I will get it. Will see what the VA says. Wouldn't it be nice if they paid interest? Free Free

Here is a nice link from a Casualty Assistance Office with a checklist of things for the spouse of a deceased veteran to apply for -- includes forms to download. http://www.rao-osan.com/retact/info/casual...y_checklist.htm And thanks to Berta for the gentle nudge in the right direction. I actually stopped procrastinating and finished my DIC application. It is ready to mail the day after Memorial Day. I guess that makes me an official widow. Free

The following link has a good SSI resource: https://www.ssa.gov/notices/supplemental-se...e/ussi-2006.pdf Free

I did get your point. And it is very helpful in letting me know how to proceed. I was just afraid that if I send in more evidence - they woud grant the claim - but then say it was because of the additional evidence. But I guess I should send in everything I can -and IF they approve DIC but deny Accrued -I can file a NOD indicating that the evidence in the File at the time of death showed SC as well. I guess the first step is to get the SC - But the VA is very tricky -- so for every battle - you have to look 20 steps down the road to see what battle you might have next if you proceed THIS way NOW. The status of his claim is questionable. He claimed for SC for In Service Occurance -- (direct) and secondary due to asbestos exposure in 2001. They denied that - and he filed a NOD. They never addressed the issue of inservice occurance -- but denied the asbestos exposure. They sent him a SSOC in 2004, which also denied him. They sent him a notice to appeal - but then sent a letter stating your appeal is being sent to the BVA. He THOUGHT this was the appeal for his cancer -- since it was the only thing he had sent a NOD in for several YEARS. In 2006 he called to check the status of his claim with the BVA and to see if we could send additional evidence. The RO said to send the additonal evidence to THEM - and they would forward it with his case to the BVA -- They told him the additional evidence would not delay the processing of his claim with the BVA. We sent a letter asking them not to send the file to the BVA until we sent the additional evidence. We sent the evidence a few weeks later. When we called the Senator's office asking for help expiditing the claim - the Senator's office got back with my husband and told him the case had been closed. My husband wrote to the RO July 2006 to ask the status of his claim -whether it was open or closed - and to tell him why it was closed - if it was, as he had thought it was being sent to the BVA. He has never recieved a reply to his request. The RO eventually sent a letter to the senator - telling THEM that his cae had been closed due to lack of appealing it - and that the letter indicating that his appeal was being sent to the BVA was for a Dental claim - NOT the cancer claim. My husband didn't know that. He had not appealled anything on the dental since 1999. That was something that just bounced back and forth between the BVA an RO for YEARS - with my husband taking no action. So - since he hadn't appealed ANYTHING for several years EXCEPT for the cancer - he THOUGHT the letter that said -Your appeal has been sent to the BVA -MEANT his cancer. The letter didn't indicate WHICH appeal - so he thought it was the one he had made in the last few years. I can see where he thought this because of their danged remand stuff boucing stuff back and forth -- He had things going back to the BVA for years without ever filling out another V-9 form. Anyway --that is what the VA told the senator. They still have not ever notified my husband if his case was closed - or if it had been re-opened. He got a letter telling him they had received the new info --and that his case could not be reopened until he submitted new and material evidence --and listed some of the evidence. So he wrote back and once again asked - IF his case had been closed (and when and why) and IF his case had been reopened - but had not received a response. He also asked them to adjudicate the claim for DIRECT inservice occurance - as that had never been addressed. They did tell the senator that his case had been reopened and was assigned to a suprvisor to expidite the processing of it due to his terminal illnes. But they haven't informed my husband of ANYTHING. So I am assuming that it was closed - Reopened in 2006 - and closed again at death. But you sure can't get any valid info on it. We tried to go the route of asking for a response in writing -- since when he called by phone he was TOLD his case WAS open --and PENDING APPEAL -and to send additional evidence to send to the Board -- But then the senator was told it was closed. Thye sure don't make it easy. Free

Berta, Thanks for the tips. I will look up the asbestos info. I think we have a pretty solid claim on the asbestos. What holds against us is the C&P examainer -who didn't see him - issued an opinion that his cancer was not related to asbestos exposure because #1 There was no evidence he was exposed to asbestos because he was not a part of any occupational screening programs that would indicate he was expsoed to abestos. #2 He did not have any other unique conditions that would suggest he was exposed to asbestos. Concerning # 1 We have evidence that shows 1. The occupational screening programs he was not a part of were not even STARTED until he was no longer an electrician. ANd that people who were no longer exposed were not part of those programs. And -- this kind of does a turn around on them on that point -- actually SUPPORTS that my husband's exposure was more dangerous as he was expsoed when there were NO safety measures in place. 2.When the Safety Measures WERE put into place -- the interior electricians (what my husband HAD done) WERE included in the occupational screening programs - and had to get OSHA training, wear respirators for certain jobs, etc. 3. Work records which show types of activities my husband did - and in what buildings - which he said exposed him to asbestos. 4. Results from the AF Base survey which was done later --which show significant asbestos problems in some of those buildings my husbands work reports show. 5. Buddy statements --verifying that at the time my husband was an electrician the electricians were exposed to asbestos - and that the training programs that were put into place AFTER my husband was no longer an electrician - taught them how to protect themselves from the exposure -- and informed then of the buildings that had significant asbestos problems - one of which was a building my husband had done extensive work in a couple of years before. 6. A job data sheet for Air Force electricians - which lists potential asbestos exposure as a one of the hazard factors of the job. 7.Copies of doctors notes (post service) from the Air Force base in which his oncologist states that he was exposed to asbestos while working as an electrician for the Air Force - and his pulmonoligist states that he was exposed to asbestos while working as an electrician and the pulmonologist notes indicate that he was at 10 percent risk for lung cancer from smoking alone, 8 percent risk of lung cancer from asbestos alone - and 80 percent risk of lung cancer from the combined effects of smoking and lung cancer. This is where the medical journal information comes into play. The Air Force docs were not TRYING To support his claim -- they were just recording their opinions in doctor notes. And though the pulmonologist told us the AF attorney's told him he can not write a letter in support of the VA claim - he HAS indicated in HIS NOTES --the increased risk from the exposure. Though the did not go into detail about the medical bases and reasons for why he noted that SEVERAL times (because these were doctors notes -and not a letter of opinion) -- Medical treatesies CAN be used to support that the doctor was applying SOUND medical principles for what is written in the notes. So both on the doubling time (in service occurance) and the increased risk from exposure to asbestos -- the combination of the doctors notes AND medical evidence (journals, etc) which show that the doctor was applying sound medical principals in his reasoning - SHOULD help the case. Concerning # 2 1. My husband has a diagnosis of Interstial Lung Disease (pathology proven) and lower lobe adenocarcinoma.,BOTH of which are consistently connected to asbestos exposure. These do not PROVE they are from asbestos. But a doctor can't just blow off Interstitial Lung Disease and lower lobe adenocarcinoma - without given a medical reason for doing so. And he didn't say though he HAS these - they are not connected. He said that he has NO unique medical conditions that would indicate that he had been exposed to asbestos --when he in fact, does. Free

Berta, My husband was the same about his claim. That is why the accrued benefits are so important to me. Not as much for me to get the money -- as for them to ACKNOWLEDGE that he had proved his case. That is why - I would rather wait a couple of years more for the end result by NOT sending in new evidence IF it would mean that it would mess up the potential for them to make a decision that his file DID show AT THE TIME OF DEATH that his cancer was SC. We widows can be a stubborn bunch when we are figthing for our husband's honor!!! My husband ended up doing his Thesis (which he completed in 2006) on the VA disability program. His professors were appalled at the process he reported. His graduate committee came to his funeral --and one of the first questions they asked me was "What will happen to his fight with the VA?" Because they knew how important that was to him and they were worried that his death meant that now the VA got by everything. I told them I would carry on his battle. I laughed when you said you send Rod's ashes to the VA. My husband had told me I should have him stuffed and mounted and have his body sent to the VA until they made a decision on his claim. Free

This is a GREAT idea. On my husband's cancer claim - he raised 2 issues: 1. That his cancer was incurred in-service (that though his cancer was not diagosed until after his presumptive period - that it is more likely than not that a 3.1 cm tumor of adenocarcinoma did NOT develop in the 2 years between his discharge and diagnosis.) 2. That the asbestos exposure he expreinced during his 13 years as an electrician for the Air Force more likely than not contributed to the development of his lung cancer. We also asked the VA to re-evaluate some of the evidence in the file. The regs clearly state procedures for Post Service Initial diagnosis of disease. And they tell how to develop a claim in which a diagnosis is made after the presumptive period. So just saying "You disease wasn't diagnosed until after your presumptive period" really isn't an adequate denial - unless they give a reason as to why that fact matters (since the regs on post-servie diagnosis clearly PRESUME the disease was NOT diagnosed until after service) The VBM manual (Thanks Berta!) states that if they just use the excuse that your disease wasn't diagnosed until after service - they are making medical assumptions about the progression of the disease - and that needs to be followed up with MEDICAL EVIDENCE (by THEM) as to why merely being diagnosed post service would be relevant. The regs do say that if a disease is diagnosed shortyl after the presumptive period -- that the VA must go back and re-evaluate evidence in light of the new information to see if the person had symptoms that initially were overlooked - but in light of the new information (definite diagnosis) now take on new meaning to show that the disease WAS manifest to the degree of 10% disability during the presumptive period. We asked them to go back and evaluate my husband's reported fatigue. He had consistently reported fatigue to the VA (AT retirement -and DURING his presumptive period) -- but first they said his fatigue did not meet the criteria of chronic fatigue syndrome (but gae no opionion as to what was causing his fatigue)... and later said his fatigue was caused by depression. We sent them medical information that shows that fatigue is actually the FIRST symptom of most lung cancers. We pointed out that he first reported fatigue when discharged from the military (a time when his cancer was growing but un-detected) and that he next reported his fatigue in 2003 (when his cancer - which was thought to be surgically cured - was once again growing but not detected again until later that year). We also gave them the Cancer Fatigue PDQ which is used to diagnose cancer fatigue (from the national cancer institute) And we pointed out that though the second C&P said his fatigue was caused by depression -- based on the BECK Depression Inventory -- he also gave a list of the answers that TRIGGERED the diagnosis of mild to moderate depression -- And the only answers that triggered the depression diagnosis were his reports of fatigue. So he goes to them - says I am tired -- I have trouble gettng things done - I am fatigued - etc. So they give him a depression inventory --on which he once again verifies that he is fatigued, tired, has trouble getting things done -- So his reports of fatigue trigger enough answers to diagnose him with DEPRESSION (because he IS FATIGUED!) And they make a diagnoses of depression - and then say it is more likely than not that hs fatigue is caused by his depression (which was ONLY diagnosed because of his FATIGUE) It was a real circular argument. The exact same questions he answered yes to on the Beck Depression Inventory are ON the Cancer Fatigue PDQ. And he didn't trigger any of the questions on the BECK inventory that were NOT related to Fatigue. So we asked that the VA go back and reconsider (in light of the later diagnosis) that his fatigue was just as likely as not related to his cancer as it was to depression) I would think they would have to do this -- as we requested them to -- and the regs clearly state they have to go back and reconsider symptoms that at first did not seem signficant --but in light of the diagnosis might take on new meaning. Free

Berta, Thanks for the link. I probably need to check a few of them out -- because I know they are not all as helpful or useful. One thing I was wondering was whether to send in any additional evidence with my DIC claim. But if the decision has to be decided on the file at the time of death (for accrued benefits) should I just let them make the decision -- and if it is favorable -- then I get DIC and accrued. If it is not favorable --then I can send in additonal evidence for DIC. Also - can the BVA remand for Acrrued benefits. Once again, if the BVA asks for additional development --then it wouldn't be things in the file at the time of death. I was just wondering -- as if I send additional evidence - and the decision is favorable - how do they sort out how much of the decision was made based on what was in the file - and how much of the decision was made on what was added. The claim for inservice occurance (started in the military) is complete. I have nothing more to send. However, for the claim for secondary as related to asbestos exposure - I still have some info to send. Most of this info is about the asbestos management programs in the Air Force -- and the Asbestos Survey from his last Air Force base that he worked as an electrician (which shows the extent of the asbestos problem on the base - and the buildings that were effected --(which happen to match up with some of the documents he already sent of the buildings where he alleged he was exposed to asbestos. For instance they already HAVE his statement that he was exposed to asbestos putting in wiring for computers -- AND a copy of the work order that showed he put in wiring for computers in a certain building. NOW we have the Asbestos Survey that shows that asbestos was actually IN that building - and where it was located.) That was also why I asked about what Service Records consist of. If the records at the time of death include Service Records that were NOT in his file, but later obtained -- then would those count? (Records from the Base which show when their asbestos management program began, and where asbestos was located on the base.) Though I know it will take much longer - I thought my best bet would be to let them make their first decision on DIC / Accrued without sending in additional evidence. That way if it was approved - there wouldn't be a question as to whether it was approved based on the info in the file at the time of death. Even if the RO denied it - I thought I should appeal to the BVA -- but again appeal based on the record on file...and let them work it through their system. Then , if it kept being denied -- I would need to send in additional evidence and get an IMO to support the claim. But right now - I would be hestitant to get an IMO - (and lose the case on accrued benefits) until I saw if the file, as is, is strong enough to stand on it's own with the VA. Free

Another difference between SSA and VA on timelines is for those with terminal illness. For one thing - terminal illness itself makes you eligible. If you have a terminal illness that is expected to result in your death in a certain time frame - you don't have to prove you can't work. My husband and I hadn't even considered SSD. In ways - it was probably good -- as I think our attitude that he was going to get better and make it through the illness really did help him live a very active life for much longer. But when we were checking on ways to cut some of our expenses -- I ran across the student loan forgiveness info - that said they used SSD guidelines. So I looked up SSD guidlines... and realized that my husband was qualified for SSD. The guiding standard for lung cancer was cancer that had invaded the mediastinum --which is what his had done. So he actually would have been elgiable for SSD back in 2004 - when they discovered his cancer had invaded the aorta - and declared him inoperable. SSD has what they call a TERI claim. If you have a terminal illness - they tag your folder as a TERI claim - and move on it - quickly. My husband was approved and had the money sent to his bank in around 3 weeks from the date of his claim. The VA has a policy that you can REQUEST to be moved up the docket at the BVA for terminal illness, advanced age, hardship... but no policy at the local level. My husband did request that his case be expidited - due to his terminal illness, but he got no response. They did sent a letter to Senator Obama - telling his office that my husband's claim was assigned to a supervisor to assist in expediting his claim. But he did not get not only a decision, but even an actual response to anything (His request for the status of his case - his request for viewing his C-file - his request for a copy of his discharge physical - etc.) Si SSD totally processed his claim in 3 weeks. The VA sent him occasional "we are working on your request" form letters for 8 months. It would seem that if a supervisor actually WAS expiditing your claim - they could at least send you SOMETHING in 8 months - even if it wasn't a decision on your case. Free

This is one of the reasons I think failure of duty to assist should be included in a CUE. I can see, in ways. why they don't want to consider duty to assist a CUE - because every case would always be open to SOMETHING they didn't do. And I can see they want to avoid that. But such BOLD FAILURE of duty to assist SHOULD be considered a CUE. Actually I was reading a couple court decisions that indicated that though failure of duty to assist could not be considered a CUE, in an of itself - but there are circumstances - such as this one -- where it could be considered such. It is not just a "they didn't notice blah, blah, blah and look for balh blah blah. This is an "I told them about the records, the records proved such and such, they did not get the records, they did not request the records, they did not tell me they didn't have the records, and they lied about it all. I think sometimes such a BOLD DISREGARD of duty to assist CAN raise to the level of CUE -- but the BVA wouldn't approve it - it would have to reach the court level Free

I keep reading about people getting TDUI. This is something we didn't know until I ran across it - but if you have Federal Student Loans - they can be discharged if you are totally disabled and unable to work. First you have to send in a form that your doctor signs stating you are unable to do ANY kind of work. When they get that - they suspend your payments, freeze the interest - and give you a conditional discharge. I think the conditional discharge is for 3 years. During this time you ARE allowed to work (AFTER you have been granted the initial conditional discharge) - but you cannot earn over the Federal Poverty wage for a family of 2 (They send you a letter every year telling you what amount that is). You have to send them your social security statement every year for them to check your earnings. After the 3 years of conditional discharge -- they totally discharge the loan. At that time any payments you made after your disbaility began will be refunded. Free

I was amazed at how little Tri-Care paid on some of the charges my husband had --The doctor told us that Tri-Care paid less for the chemo than it cost the doctor - but they made up the difference on office fees etc. When we were ordering home medical equipment - the provider told us that Tri-Care pays the same rate that Medicare does for equipment. That might be true for most of their payments - they run pretty close to Medicare. We have Tri-Care Prime, which might make a difference. With that you have to go to a Military Provider if one is available -and have to get authorizations for things. But we never had a problem with those. In fact -- my husband needed something that Tri_care and medicare usually don't cover - but I called Tri-Care and they said they could pre-authorize it if he had a letter of medical neccessity. Both the doctor's office and medical equipment supplier kept telling me they woudn't cover it -- but they did. Just because they won't AUTOMATICALLY cover something - no questions asked -- does not mean they will not cover it. You just have to jump through more hoops to show you need it. When I told the nurse we needed a letter of medical neccessity - She said that was what the precription was. NOT! No wonder they never get those things approved --if they don't understand that a precription is not a letter explaining WHY something is medically neccessary. In fact the first time they told me that Tri_care had DENIED the claim. She showed me the letter. It didn't say the claim was denied. It said it wasn't approved yet - as they needed more information. So I think sometimes the providers themselves cause the problems that they balme on Tri-Care. I did have some problems with some physicians trying to charge above the copay amount after my husband's death. Tri-care has a daily rate for being in the hospital. And everything is covered. But several doctor's, technicians, etc sent me bills - showing my husband still owed money. Rather than fighting each one of the about it - I just called Tri-care and told them the providers were trying to charge us fees that were not allowable. Tri_care handled it. They sent the providers a letter and sent me a copy - telling them they could not do that. Had I not known my husband's coverage - I would have just paid the bills. I imagine a lot of people do. I was reading an article where some retiree's tried to sue because they were promised FREE medical care for themselves and their dependents. The lawsuit was about TriCare requiring 65+ retirees to purchase medicare. They did not win the suit. The Supreme Court said the promises for free medical care were backed by statute - not contract. http://www.ll.georgetown.edu/federal/judic...ns/99-1402.html I think that is also one of the reasons vets are denied things with the VA. Like equitable tolling in many cases. Anything that is considered an "entitlement" isn't as protected by law as you would think. For instance, if you file a claim within one year of complete disability -- they can go back one year. But if you wait over a year -- it only goes by te filing date. My husband did not file within a year of his cancer diagnosis because he was misinformed about the type of cancer. He was treated at the Air Force Base - but had his surgery at a civilian hospital. For a whole year the Air Force Docs kept telling him it was small cell lung cancer..which grows pretty quickly. It is in all his medical records at the Base (post service records). After a year - they read the biopsy reports and told him that it was NONsmall cell lung cancer - and due to the slow growth rate of pulmonary adenocarcinoma - that it had most likely started 12 - 15 years before he retired from the service. The doctor even noted in the records that the records had been wrong and the patient had been misinformed as to the type of cancer. (But he still just noted "Important differences explained to the patient") and gave him a handwritten note of the growth rates and doubling times). Anyway -- in a civil court - this would be a case for equitable tolling. Or as my husband explained in his inital letter of claim - he did not file sooner because he had been misinformed. So a civil court would equitably toll the 1 year filing deadline. But from the cases I have read at the VA -- that wouldn't fly at the VA. 1 year is 1 year. It was not the VA that misinformed him (thought it WAS military doctors) - and VA benefits are an "entitlement" -- not a "right." etc. etc. etc. Free Free

Yes. I opened for me this time too! VERY nice site - with some good down to earth information..on LOTS of things.I pulled up the PDF version and saved a copy. Actually - According to this site - I DID PART what they tell you to do. " Rather than filing VA Form 21-534, Application for Death Pension, recommend the VSO send VA Form 21-4138 to VA, signed by the surviving spouse, stating, "Since my income disallows me Death Pension, this is a claim for my spouse's check for the month of death. I have not returned the check." That was the Statement in Support of Claim the lady at the VA had me send in. I sent that in a couple of months ago. But I didn't say anything about the Death Pension - because I didn't know to say it at that time. I don't quite understand this part: " If a TINQ (Treasury Inquiry) shows that the veteran's check or direct deposit was returned, a letter will be sent stating, "Since you are entitled to the veterans payment for the month of death, you are not required to return the check or direct deposit." It seems to contradict itself. But I guess since I am filing for DIC - I will get the $225 back IF I get approved. If I get the $225 -- they will deduct that from the initial DIC. But here is another question that just occured to me. Moving BEYOND the $225. If they approve my husband's claim for SC for his lung cancer -- then his payment the last month will be much MORE than $225 - it would be 100%. But the February payment would NOT be an accrued benefit, for the same reason that the $225 was taken back -- because he wasn't alive on the LAST DAY of February...so he wouldn't have an accrued benefit for that month. So would that mean his accrued benefits would run through January -- but that I would also be entitled to the whole amount for 100% that he WOULD have been paid in February had his SC been granted while he was alive? (less the $225 IF they ever give it back?) I just wondered - because that just occured to me. I dug deep enough down in the pile of stuff - and found my DIC claim. It is mostly filled out. So I guess I will get that sent off and start the clock ticking. I haven't picked a Service Organization yet. I know the one my husband had wasn't really helpful at all. I see the forms they had him fill out. Like on his Appeal Forms -- they just had him LIST the conditions he was appealing and sign it. I mean one word things; Right shoulder, left knee... etc. Just the words. I asked him why he just did that - because from what I read - the VA could throw that out as NOT a perfected appeal. He told me the Vet Rep filled it out and just had him sign it. I called another organization in a different county when I was helping my ex-father-in-law with trying to increase his pension for housebound (95 years old) -but the guy never returned my calls. Then he told my ex-husband that my ex-FIL would have to go to a doctor FIRST -- and THEN file a claim. I thought he should file his claim FIRST and get the clock ticking. At 95 - who knows how long it will tick. I dropped the ball on helping him - because my husband got sick -- but they still haven't even claimed medical expenses. The guy is getting $38 a month Vet Pension - and not claiming his Medicare Premiums. I talked to some people locally at on organization here that seemed pretty helpful. I might go talk to them again. Does anyone know of a good Vet Rep in the St. Louis Metro East area (Illinois). Free

Most of the government programs don't want to send checks anymore. My son gets his SSI payment by check, but he gets all kinds of info from them wanting him to sign up for direct deposit..or now they even are promoting a debit card type thing to put your payment on. I was still surprised they could take something that was deposited to my husband in OUR account out of MY account. Free

Berta, I wasn't able to open the article from the Indiana Vets site. I can open the main page. The regulation M21-1, Part IV 26.02. states: http://www.warms.vba.va.gov/admin21/m21_1/...4/chg216err.doc (a) Requests over the phone must be recorded on VA Form 119, “Report of Contact” and the caller must provide oral verification satisfactory to the veteran’s service representative that the caller is the surviving spouse. If there is any question as to the validity of the surviving spouse status, appropriate development should be undertaken. So what I am thinking happened is since SHE didn't fill out the VA Form 119 - and instead told ME to send in a statement in support of claim - the appropriate paperwork was not filed. I don't think she really wanted to bother with it. First she told me there is no spouse award. Then she told me that there was - and I was entitled to keep it. Then she decided I should send in SOMETHING - because she said they tell spouse's the can keep the payment - and then the VA ends up taking it back (Well..yeah..IF they --as in the VA don't fill out the right paperwork), Then she told me I could send in ANY kind of claim form for it -- but eventually settled on the Statement in Support of Claim. My Statement in Support of Claim is most likely sitting in HIS file unread at the moment. THe Manual further states: (a) If a request for the veteran’s rate for the month of death is accompanied by VA Form 21-534, “Application for Dependency and Indemnity Compensation, Death Pension, and Accrued Benefits,” a merit determination for death benefits will be made prior to awarding benefits under 38 CFR 3.20©. So IF you file for DIC --WHEN you request the month of death payment - they wait until the DIC is decided. So if I get the month of death payment - and later get DIC -- they will deduct the $225 from my first DIC check. But they can't make you file for DIC to get the month of Death Payment -- as many widows are not eligible for DIC -- but ALL are entitled to the last VA payment if they were married to, and living with, the spouse at the time of death. If you file for DIC more than a year after the vets death - they don't deduct the month of death payment (because you basically have waived your right to the first year of DIC). "Note: If a surviving spouse files a claim for Dependency and Indemnity Compensation (DIC) more than one year after the veteran’s death, or death pension more than 45 days after the veteran’s death and establishes entitlement, the claimant is still eligible for the veteran’s rate for the month of death under 38 CFR 3.20©. Note 2: Payment as described under 38 CFR 3.20© should not be confused with payment of the veteran’s rate for the month of death under 38 CFR 3.20(:(. Under 38 CFR 3.20(, payment should be made to the surviving spouse for the month of death on the original death award (see 36.01(a)). (4) If, after payment under 38 CFR 3.20©, the surviving spouse subsequently becomes entitled to death benefits from the date of the veteran’s death at a rate higher than the amount paid under 38 CFR 3.20©, an offset should be established (38 CFR 3.20(:o and 3.31). Create the offset for recovery of the veteran’s rate for the month of death prior to the original award of DIC or death pension." The manual TELLS them what to do: (2) Use a locally generated letter to send one of two possible messages, depending on whether TINQ (Treasury Inquiry) shows that the veteran’s check or direct deposit has been returned, either: (a) We will re-issue payment to you; or (:( Since you are entitled to the veteran’s payment for the month of death, you are not required to return the check or direct deposit. (3) In either instance, send the claims folder to Finance with the following notation on OF 41: “Surviving spouse entitled to 1-time payment of [amount of monthly compensation or pension received by the veteran at time of death] per 38 CFR 3.209©.” If payment has been returned, request Finance to re-issue the payment to the surviving spouse (06A transaction). If payment has not been returned, notify Finance that the overpayment should be removed (08E transaction). Input of the 08E transaction must be accomplished within 45 days of the debt being established. The finance activity must notify the Debt Management Center (DMC) of the action so that they can stop the reclamation process. If the debt has been in the system for 60 days, DMC cannot stop the reclamation process when the finance activity inputs the 08E transaction. I didn't get that letter -- most likely because they didn't follow the procedures and my Statement in Support of Claim is probably sitting around somewhere. It still aggravates me that they did not follow the procedures -- and the money was snatched in a DIFFERENT bank account -- without notice to me from anyone. I know. I know. I need to get the DIC claim in. I have it all done except for the Pension part - and I won't even be eligible for Pension - but I know that want that too - since THEY want to decide if I am eligible - and actually they are SUPPOSED to decide that. Getting it done and sent has been on my to do list lots of times -- but it never makes the top priority part of my to do list. So by the time I get done with all the "what HAS to be done today" things -- it gets shifted to the next days to do list. I keep thinking --when I get this done - or get that done - I will get more time to tie up all this other stuff. But other things rise to the forefront. I am working through the pile of stuff on my dining room table now - and trying to get them ALL done in whatever order they are in my stack..lol Free

Your kindness is much appreciated. I read your post and then went for a walk and cried for awhile --and felt a little better. Thank you, Free

Nope - haven't even gotten around to filing for DIC yet. The VA Should NOT even HAVE my personal bank account number. I guess when they tried to reclaim it from our joint account --and that was closed - the bank just transferred the reclamation over to MY account. Sure don't know why they couldn't have told the VA the account was closed --and let them bill me. According to the regs -- the VA should send a form to Finance IF the money has been reclaimed -and have them issue me a check.. But we will see how much they screw that up - because they SHOULD have just filled out the correct form and not reclaimed it in the first place - instead of telling me to send in a statement in support of claim which is probably now taking up space in the backlog of claims in Chicago. I still need to GO to the bank and discuss their "policy." But they told me it was because it was the Government. Now this worries me because my husband's retirement check also was deposited into our joint account. When I called the Retiree Pay folks -they said that I got to keep the February payment because it was really the payment for January. But that is just what they SAID. So --based on what happened - if they decide different - that means they can just come back without telling me and suck the money out of MY account. A creditor has to get a JUDGEMENT -- and give you time to PAY before they can attach your bank account. But I guess the government can just TELL you that you can KEEP the money --and then swoop in and take it back any time they damn well please... Free

Hopefully your two accounts are at different banks. Because the account they are sucking it out of is MINE --the account it was deposited in was OURS -- and that account is closed. FREE

I haven't filed for DIC yet. Maybe you vets should copy http://www.warms.vba.va.gov/admin21/m21_1/...4/chg216err.doc and keep it with important papers -- so hopefully your spouse won't have them sucking money out when they least expect it. Now IF I had filed DIC WHEN I ask for his month of death payment -then they wait until the DIC is decided. How many years should you wait for $225?? But if you DON'T file DIC at the time -- and later GET DIC -- then they will take the $225 OFF the amount I would get later --IF I get it. If you wait a year to file DIC - you get to keep the month of death payment (I imagine because if you wait a year - you give up retro. As long as I file DIC in a year -- they will go back 12 months if awarded). But the reglations CLEARLY tell the RO what to do if there is a spouse. THEY are supposed to complete the VA Form 119 - and then let Finance know NOT to reclaim the money - or if it has been reclaimed already - have finance issue a check. But when I called to report his death - they told me there wasn't any payment to the surviving spouse - that it all goes back. But then they sent me a letter (form letter) that said if you are the surviving spouse you may be entitled to the last payment and call the toll-free number. At first the woman acted like there was no such thing as the widow getting the last payment --then she changed her mind...and said I got to keep it -- But then she decided I should fill out something -- but couldn't decide what - so they wouldn't take the money back. I told her the VA 119 -but she said that was an in house form --and just told me to fill out a statement of claim. Now - several months later -- with NO warning from the VA OR the Bank -- they put a reclaim on my money. I was checking my account balance online -- and my available balance was less than it should be - with nothing recorded.. So I called. THEY didn't know. But she said she had to "Dig" to find it. Apparently they haven't TAKEN the money out yet -- but have placed a hold on it. What gets me is I opened a DIFFERENT account in my name only. I left the joint account open. Well - THEY left it open --because I tried to close it - and they thought I should leave it open for awhile. But the account didn't have hardly any money in it - I had wiped it out to pay for the funeral. But somehow - and I still don't know how -- AT&T started debiting the joint account. Last month they took funds out -- and this month there weren't enough funds - so they charged a $20 service fee TWICE --for an automatic debit I didn't even authorize. (Can't get anywhere with AT&T yet -- as the debit isn't connected to OUR phone --but I will keep tracking that down). So I went in to CLOSE the account. And the bank suggested I turn OFF the PHONE. Yep. That will solve my problem. If I turn off my phone --then AT&T will stop debiting my acount for some bill that isn't even mine. I finally got them to close the account and reverse the service fees.. But --if it had been a legit charge --they didn't even bother to take money from my other account for THAT. That is what I questioned today.. How can you debit MY account for a charge to the OTHER account - especially when you charged me $20 to BOUNCE and $18 debit from the joint account when it WAS open? You didn't take money out of MY account THEN! She said that this is different --that this is the GOVERNMENT --with a Big G. SO since I had been named on the OTHER account -- they could put the block on MY account. I haven't seen their rule that says that yet. That is just what I was told. But what they are telling me is that if my name was on another account at the bank -and that account is closed --they can suck it out of my own account.. And what ticks me off is that the VA placed a hold on my money on Monday --but neither them or my bank notified me --until I called today (Thursday) and asked -and then they had to "dig" to find out why I didn't have the available balance I should have. Free

Sent this through IRIS: Per regulation M21-1, Part IV 26.02. My husband died February 5th. I received a letter from the VA which told me to contact the toll free number - I asked about the form VA Form 119 - but the person on the phone told me that was an In House Form - and that the way to stop the payment for the month of death from being reclaimed from my bank account was to send in a statement in support of claim --stating that I was entitled to keep the payment - and asking that it not be reclaimed. Apparently it is being reclaimed because my bank has a $225 hold on my checking account (my PERSONAL checking account) from the VA. I do not know why I was told to send in a statement in support of claim instead of the procedures listed in the manual being followed. I would like to know: 1. If the VA will STOP the reclamation process? or if not 2. If they will follow the procedures in the manual and direct Financing to re-issue the check to me. Thank you.

Here are the regs on that: I asked the person at the RO to fill out the VA form 119 - lke it says - to STOP the Reclaimation process. But she told me it was an "in house" form - and that I would have to send in a statement in support of claim instead.... Of course it is an IN-HOUSE form - SHE was SUPPOSED to fill it out! Veterans Benefits Administration M21-1, Part IV Department of Veterans Affairs Change 216 Erratum Washington, DC 20420 April 26, 2005 Veterans Benefits Manual M21-1, Part IV, “Authorization Procedures,” is changed as follows: Pages 26-I-5 through 26-I-8: Remove these pages and substitute pages 26-I-5 through 26-I-8 attached. Paragraph 26.01j is modified to include two additional examples of cases requiring a determination as to a surviving spouse’s entitlement to a deceased veteran’s benefit or rate of payment for the month of death. LOCAL REPRODUCTION AUTHORIZED April 26, 2005 M21-1, Part IV Change 216 Erratum month of death as a claim for this benefit. This includes a request over the phone or written notification. Authority 38 U.S.C. 5101. (a) Requests over the phone must be recorded on VA Form 119, “Report of Contact” and the caller must provide oral verification satisfactory to the veteran’s service representative that the caller is the surviving spouse. (:( If there is any question as to the validity of the surviving spouse status, appropriate development should be undertaken. (a) If a request for the veteran’s rate for the month of death is accompanied by VA Form 21-534, “Application for Dependency and Indemnity Compensation, Death Pension, and Accrued Benefits,” a merit determination for death benefits will be made prior to awarding benefits under 38 CFR 3.20©. (2) Use a locally generated letter to send one of two possible messages, depending on whether TINQ (Treasury Inquiry) shows that the veteran’s check or direct deposit has been returned, either: (a) We will re-issue payment to you; or ( Since you are entitled to the veteran’s payment for the month of death, you are not required to return the check or direct deposit. (3) In either instance, send the claims folder to Finance with the following notation on OF 41: “Surviving spouse entitled to 1-time payment of [amount of monthly compensation or pension received by the veteran at time of death] per 38 CFR 3.209©.” If payment has been returned, request Finance to re-issue the payment to the surviving spouse (06A transaction). If payment has not been returned, notify Finance that the overpayment should be removed (08E transaction). Input of the 08E transaction must be accomplished within 45 days of the debt being established. The finance activity must notify the Debt Management Center (DMC) of the action so that they can stop the reclamation process. If the debt has been in the system for 60 days, DMC cannot stop the reclamation process when the finance activity inputs the 08E transaction. Note: If a surviving spouse files a claim for Dependency and Indemnity Compensation (DIC) more than one year after the veteran’s death, or death pension more than 45 days after the veteran’s death and establishes entitlement, the claimant is still eligible for the veteran’s rate for the month of death under 38 CFR 3.20©. Note 2: Payment as described under 38 CFR 3.20© should not be confused with payment of the veteran’s rate for the month of death under 38 CFR 3.20(:o. Under 38 CFR 3.20(:(, payment should be made to the surviving spouse for the month of death on the original death award (see 36.01(a)). (4) If, after payment under 38 CFR 3.20©, the surviving spouse subsequently becomes entitled to death benefits from the date of the veteran’s death at a rate higher than the amount paid under 38 CFR 3.20©, an offset should be established (38 CFR 3.20(:( and 3.31). Create the offset for recovery of the veteran’s rate for the month of death prior to the original award of DIC or death pension. (a) Withhold all benefits under Type 1 withholding from the date of entitlement. Suppress the award letter. After the award showing total withholding has been authorized, route the claims folder to Finance for action to establish the offset. Deliver these folders to Finance daily. (B) When the folder is returned from Finance, ensure the offset appears on the M01 screen. Process an amended award. Remove the withholding (show “0” entry under Type Withholding) and pay full benefits to which the surviving spouse is entitled. j. Four Types of Cases Requiring a Determination as to a Surviving Spouse’s Entitlement to a Deceased Veteran’s Benefit or Rate of Payment for the Month of Death. If the veteran was in receipt of benefits at the time of 26-I-5 M21-1, Part IV April 26, 2005 Change 216 Erratum death and a merit determination regarding the surviving spouse’s claim for improved death pension or Dependency and Indemnity Compensation (DIC) has been made, an additional determination must be made regarding the surviving spouse’s entitlement to the veteran’s benefit or rate of payment for the month of the veteran’s death. (1) A surviving spouse’s entitlement to death benefits has been established. The claim was received more than one year after the veteran’s death. The surviving spouse is entitled to the veteran’s benefit for the month of death under 38 CFR 3.20©. Send OF 41 to Finance (see 26.01i(3)). The provisions of § 3.20(B) do not apply, since the surviving spouse was not entitled to death benefits for the month of the veteran’s death. Therefore, a comparison between the veteran’s rate of payment at the time of death and the surviving spouse’s rate of DIC/death pension is unnecessary. (2) A surviving spouse’s entitlement to death benefits has been established. The claim was received within one year of the veteran’s death. The surviving spouse’s rate of payment is greater than the veteran’s rate for the month of death. Per 38 CFR 3.20(B), DIC may not be paid for the month in which the veteran died since the surviving spouse’s rate of DIC is greater. However, under the provisions of 38 CFR 3.20©, the surviving spouse is entitled to the benefit the veteran would have received that same month, but for his/her death. (3) A surviving spouse’s entitlement to death benefits has been established. The claim was received within one year of the veteran’s death. The surviving spouse’s rate of payment is less than the veteran’s rate for the month of the veteran’s death. The surviving spouse is entitled to the veteran’s rate for the month of death under 38 CFR 3.20(B). Payment for the month of death is included in the original award to the surviving spouse. (4) The surviving spouse’s entitlement to death benefits has been denied. The surviving spouse is entitled to the veteran’s benefit for the month of death under 38 CFR 3.20©(1). Send OF 41 to Finance (see 26.01i(3)). 26.02 AWARD TO SURVIVOR UPON DEATH OF DEPENDENT OF A DECEASED VETERAN a. General. Upon receipt of an acceptable statement or evidence of death of a payee, discontinue the award to the deceased payee using reason code 22, Death of Person Entitled. (1) If evidence is required to establish continued entitlement for one or more surviving beneficiaries, do not change his or her payments pending receipt of the required evidence within the 60-day control period established for this purpose. If the evidence is not received by the expiration of the control period, terminate any affected awards (reason code 16) as of date of last payment. Notice is required, as well as the right to appeal. (2) If necessary evidence is received within 1 year of the request, adjust or reopen any award to a surviving payee as of the effective date of termination of the decedent's award (38 CFR 3.651). Include an appropriate notation in "Remarks" as to the date of death and name and relationship of the deceased. Enter the applicable dependency codes to reflect the change in the number of dependents on which the entitlement is based. (3) Unless a statement furnishing month and year of death may be accepted under 38 CFR 3.213, proof of death of the payee meeting the requirements of 38 CFR 3.211 will be required in all cases. b. Death of a Surviving Spouse. Terminate the surviving spouse's award using reason code 22 effective the first day of the month of death. The provisions of subparagraph 26.07e relating to remarriage of a surviving spouse are for equal application in establishing the entitlement of children in cases involving the death of a surviving spouse.

A couple of months ago I looked up the regs -- and it said that the Va payment for the month of death is a right of the widow. I got the VA letter - and it said to call the tool-free number - so I did. I was told that I had to send in a statement of claim asking to be allowed to keep the February payment -and that it NOT be reclaimed. I have since closed my joint bank account with my husband. (AT&T was taking money out, but was not authorized to do so - and was not even applying it to our phone bill - so who knows who authorized them to take it out -or where it was going -- I just closed the account - and still have to sort things out with AT&T -which is hard because the fact they are taking money out of OUR bank account is NOT recorded to OUR phone bill - so I haven't found anyone to trace it yet). Anyway - I Have a personal account with the same bank - which I opened after my husband's death. Today I called to ask why my avaliable amount is reduced by $225.. The VA has a hold on it. Since our joint account is no longer open - the VA is reclaiming the payment for the month of death from MY account. Geez!! It is amazing how fast they can do THAT!! Too bad they can't pay that fast.... And they wasted MY time and THEIR time - sending me letters telling me to call - and answering my call - and telling me what to do to keep the funds --if they were going to take them back and make me send in another claim to add to their backlog to get the $225 back. I will have to say it is NOT just the VA -- I have gotten the run-around from Social Security (who - since my son is disabled (autism) --and on SSI - reduced his SSI benefits by 1/3 because he was living with us and receiving support from my husband -- but when he applied for SSD on my husband's record denied him -- because he was not living with my husband or receving support from him (????) The same dang office -- and one cuts his benefits because of my husband's support and one denied him benefits because my husband wasn't supporting him..., the mortgage company, the credit card company who took two months to close my husband's account while fraudulent charges were being added to his card, --well -- pretty much everyone... Again, it is the no acountability issue -- a world full of toll free numbers in which no one is responsible for what they tell you - so they just tell you anything. I am tired........ Free

I have Durbin and Obama down in my neck of the woods. Free