Va New Fugitive Felon Program

[bigmuny]

Recently I learned I had a warrant out of Florida. I had never been arrested or even had a ticket there or anywhere for that matter, so I was surprised when I received a letter from the VA stating they would be cutting off my benefits unless I could show the warrant had been cleared but that they would still charge me an overpayment beginning from the date the warrant was placed against me which was 06-12-2006 until the date the warrant was cleared 12-14-07, so the amount will be about $70,000 according to the amount I receive every month. This also stops medical, pharmacy, insurance and any other benefit one may receive from the VA.

I began researching this new law the "FFP" (Fugitive Felon Program) under Section 505 of Public Law 107-103, that has taken effect in 2001 across the board for all Federal agencies, including Food Stamps, SS, SSI and so on. To date the Fed Gov. states they are saving hundreds of millions of dollars by cutting benefits.

Searching the Veteran's Law it states the only way the VA can stop one's benefits based on a warrant as such is if that Veteran is considered a "Fugitive Felon" ... which is one who knows they have a warrant, who is actively fleeing from the Law, trying to hide their whereabouts and such. Now the VA doesn't distinguish the precedent set by the Law, whether it be the Social Security ALJ, or Federal District Courts, etc...they state that even if a person doesn't know they have a warrant against them and are not trying to hide or flee from justice doesn't matter, they will still hold them accountable for the overpayment even if they get the warrant cleared. The VA Committee on Waivers CAN waive the overpayment based on a number of factors the most popular being hardship, and in this case it would most definately be hardship...not many people I know have $70K laying around in the bank.

Now since I have gotten the warrant cleared, the VA will reinstate my disability payments and I did this all within 2 weeks of learning that I had a warrant so I didn't get to the automatic cut-off date of 60 days the VA gives one to appeal the decision or request a hearing. Now all I have to contend with is the matter of overpayment, so what I have to prove is that I wasn't a Fugitive Felon as described by Blacks Law dictionary. The strongest defense is how could one be a Fugitive Felon if they don't even know they have a warrant against them to begin with??? Not including the fact of leaving a Forwarding Address with the Post Office, having Direct Deposit, Voter's Registration, Credit Cards and probably in every computer system from here to Mars, so I could have been located at any time had Law Enforcement wanted me. Also, the fact I have never received any notices in the mail or telephone calls or personal visits by Law Enforcement. This should work well in my defense as all the decisions I have read from the BVA and other Courts have decided in favor of the Veteran, unless of course they are as described by the Law a Fugitive Felon.

Why the VA puts in that extra phrase in their description of a Fugitive Felon "even if the Veteran has a Warrant and doesn't know about it"..when all the other Agencies use the exact wording under Blacks Law. This is the contradiction between VA Policy and Law and Law prevails but who wants to wait to have to appeal their case in the 2 or 3 years it takes to run the course of an appeal???

This program, the FFP "Fugitive Felon Program".. is handled by the OIG of the VA..which is the Office of Inspector General. They match records with law enforcement and when they find someone with a warrant, regardless of the events, they notify the local Law Enforcement and if they want to pick them up they can, however these guys are Special Agents with arrest powers also, they are the one's who set out in front of your home or watch you if they believe you are trying to defraud the VA by claiming benefits you aren't really entitled to, for instance watching a Veteran at the VA come in on a cane or walker and then watch them when they leave without the cane or walker, they will do this you know. They will even set out in front of the homes...and it goes on and on...What happens when the OIG finds out the Vet has a warrant they put the Veteran's name in a program called the VistA program..this in turn flags the VA patient files to notify the VA Police or their Supervisor of the Veteran's status and that they have a warrant. What will probably happen is the VA Police will notify the local law enforcement who will come and initiate an arrest on the premises. Now all of this is fine and dandy but believe it or not there are many people who have a warrant for whatever reason that they have no knowledge of whatsoever...could be a neighbor swore out a charge against you or you have failed to pay a fine or ticket or didn't show up to court for jury duty...any number of things that can start this process..This whole program is punitive in nature toward those Veterans who are Law abiding citizens but have this warrant against them for whatever reason...now if one has never been arrested how is one to know anything. This is where the system needs to be overhauled, in my opinion and yours too if you ever get caught up in this nightmare.

I'm bringing this to everyone's attention for information only, if you ever have something like this happen to you then you can be aware..and those Veteran's who offer advice on benefits will research this to understand it a little bit better..

I would like to hear if anyone else has had a similiar problem and what they did to correct it??

[Ricky]

No matter the reason it has brought about some good discussion (until my ole skeletons were attacked :D ). Each of the federal agencies that this law affects has their own interpertation. Each of them are very close. Now the VA is no different and we all know that a they along with all other federal agencies interpert the law, develop their CFR's based upon that interpertation and implement the law. Is this wrong? mabye so but it is not up to me or anyone else to say they can not do it. The only body that can change this process is Congress. All CFR's are that agencies interpertations of the law.

This is the spin that SSA uses to implement the FFA:

"The POMS do not require that a decision to deny or terminate benefits be based on any evidence that the person has knowingly or intentionally fled. Simply put, a person is considered a “fleeing felon” anytime there is a felony warrant Thus, SSA policy provides that an individual is ineligible for benefits based on the mere existence of any felony warrant even if the individual has no actual notice of the warrant and there is no evidence of intent to flee to avoid prosecution."

They also have a reference to "high misdemeanors" as this is quite common with federal agencies. You will find it mostly in their guides on hiring practices. And yes there is a need for it. As an example in some states certain levels of rape are classified as high misdemeanors. Even though it has this tag of misdemeanor it is still considered a felony by the federal government and a majority of the other states (and you don't have to be charged with the US felony).

And most are thankful. As an example: I am pretty sure that as an applicant for a federal job you can be hired if you have been convicted of a misdemeanor. However, if you have been convicted of a felony don't waste you time with the application process. To me this is good - lets say I am a young female, GS7 working late with the guy in the cubical next to me. He was hired even though he raped a young lady in his home town. Now in hind sight I probably would not have been assualted that night only if the govt had been allowed to tell its personnel department to consider "high misdemeanors" the same as felonies. This is just a basic example but it could happen.

People tend to get bent out of shape when they see any agency saying that a high misdemeanor is to be considered the same as a felony. I guess they just see the word misdemeanor. From what I have seen states that use the high misdemeanor charge do so for very serious crimes such as rape, robbery etc... they are not just an excessive speeding charge or one for a bad check. However, From what I have read most states that use the high misdemeanor charge understand this problem and most are now using the class A, B and C felony charges with A being the old high misdemeanor. I think this was needed for a felony should be a felony and a misdemeanor should be a misdemeanor. I personaly do not want to be in a one on one situation with a coworker who robbed an old man but was hired due to a technicality (misdemeanor vs felony). Thats just me though and not every body thinks like I do hahahahaha.

Now the fleeing thing I agree with Time. Either you are fleeing or you or not. Now the portion on violating probation is fairly clear and does not require an act of fleeing. However, there are differences in the way a state and the federal govt looks at the word fleeing. As state will place you on fugative status if they have a felony warrant for your arrest and they can not find you at your normal place of residence. You could be only 20 miles away staying with someone and you have fled. The federal govt says in order to be fleeing you must have taken flight to another state or country. Anyway as I said, in agreement with Time either you are fleeing or you or not. Seems pertty simple but I guess its not.

On this warrant issue - I apoligize to anyone that I offended even the OP. It was not worded very well and was in response to the OP's statement that he did not know a warrant existed. I did not mean that he had to post the reason for the warrant for as Time stated that ain't none of our biz whacks. What I was trying to do is get the reader to think about the post cause I think that anyone who commits a felony, some where in the back of their mind, has to know that a warrant is probably floating around out there. I know if I murdered or raped someone or embellezed money etc.... I would be pretty sure that some where out there a warrant existed. Thats just me though and maybe you guys are different.

Well I guess all of you are tired of hearing me spout off my opinion on this subject just because it is the only thing I have to do at four a.m. in the morning - meds are kicking my butt hahahahaha. Anyway I would just like to say one more thing and there will be no more opinions from me on this subject:

Time I love ya but I have to disagree with you on your speeding ticket example. Every day in this country there are thousands of drivers issued speeding tickets that are not actually speeding. At least that is what they tell the judge!!!! hahahahahaha

Edited January 1, 2008 by Ricky

[timetowinarace]

Time I love ya but I have to disagree with you on your speeding ticket example. Every day in this country there are thousands of drivers issued speeding tickets that are not actually speeding. At least that is what they tell the judge!!!! hahahahahaha

Heh Heh, ummmmm, well that would be me. :D LOL.