Comp To Stop At

[Berta]

This is email from Ray B. Davis- well known vets advocate-

I am not commenting at all on Ray's letter to the Pres- it is just part of the email copy-and no reason to start some political ranting at all here-

I sure didnt see this idea in the Dole Shalala report-

SSA is earned by work credits for retirement-to include military service- and VA comp is due to SC sacrifice-

I cannot imagine why this is even an issue but appraently it is now---

Then again I have not checked this info out-and believe Philpott-not that Ray would put anything untrue on his site- it is just absolutely bizarre to me that anyone would even attempt to pull something like this:

(actually I just managed to delete what Ray said about Bush-if you want to read his letter to Bush go to his web site )

"The article further states that at age 65 all your VA compensation

would go away when you start to receive Social Security. FROM the

article:

" VA compensation likely would be raised under the plan to include a

quality-of-life allowance. But the portion of VA compensation now

provided, and intended only to cover reduced earnings capacity, would

stop at age 65 when social security begins. "

What this means is that if you current get a 50 percent rating and

are paid $712.00 per month (which is the current rate for lost

earnings); the VA may boost your pay for "loss of quality of life" by

10 percent to: $783.00; BUT AT AGE 65 THE LOSS OF EARNING AMOUNT, OF

$712.00 WILL BE TAKEN AWAY, AND ALL THAT WILL BE LEFT IS THE $71.20

FOR THE LOSS OF QUALITY OF LIFE.

(another part deleted by me- full letter at valaw.org)

Sincerely,

Your Editor,

Ray B Davis, Jr

http://www.valaw.org

(Ray's take on it all is interesting -to say the least-and I dont feel appropriate to put it all here but the actual article is the main point)

-- Article on losing Compensation --

Better Pay for Combat-Related Disabilities?

Tom Philpott | August 23, 2007

Bush Backs Separate Combat-Related Disability System

The Bush administration is preparing a legislative proposal to

present to Congress in September that would establish a separate and,

under most circumstances, a more generous disability package for

service members who are injured in war or while training for war,

sources said.

Under the plan, recommended by the Dole-Shalala commission, service

members found unfit for duty as a result of combat or combat-training

injuries, regardless of the number of years served, would qualify for

an immediate lifetime annuity from the Department of Defense.

Annuity amounts would be based on the formula used to calculate

regular retired pay: 2.5 percent of basic pay multiplied by years in

service. A wounded warrior with two years of service thus would get

five percent of basic pay. Likewise, a service member injured in

combat training who had served 10 years when found unfit would get 25

percent of basic pay.

These members also would be get lifetime TRICARE, the military health

and pharmacy plan. Separately they would get disability compensation

from the Department of Veterans Affairs for any and all service-

connected injuries or ailments. VA compensation likely would be

raised under the plan to include a quality-of-life allowance. But the

portion of VA compensation now provided, and intended only to cover

reduced earnings capacity, would stop at age 65 when social security

begins.

The legislation is being drafted by DoD and VA officials and they

continue to work out critical details. One issue outstanding is

whether the changes should be applied retroactively, perhaps to all

combat-related disabled members injured since the attacks of 9-11.

But the Bush administration has decided that these disability pay

changes should apply only to members with injuries from combat or

combat training. That, officials say, adheres to the theme of Dole-

Shalala, also known as the President's Commission on Care of

America's Returning Wounded Warriors. Because the commission's

charter focused solely on the needs of combat wounded veterans, its

recommendations do too.

Under the White House plan, non-combat disabled members still would

come under current service disability retirement, with percentage

awards based only on conditions that make the individual unfit for

service. Non-combat disabled members rated below 30 percent still

would get a lump-sum severance payment instead of an annuity and

would not qualify for TRICARE.

This point is expected to be vigorously opposed by advocates for

disabled members. Though they generally are excited about the changes

planned for combat-related injuries, advocates see stark inequities

in having separate disability packages, one for wounded warriors and

one for members with other service-connected injuries or ailments.

The White House position also seems to be in conflict with a

principle of the Veterans' Disability Benefits Commission, which will

complete its two-year comprehensive study of disability benefits in

October. That commission already has voted not to treat disability

benefits differently based on whether an injury is received in

combat, advocates point out.

One administration official brought another warning. If the VA-

portion of disability compensation is not boosted as much as

envisioned by Dole-Shalala, then certain disabled warriors actually

might receive less in overall disability pay than non-combat disabled

peers with equal rated conditions.

Though advocates for disabled veterans see the Dole-Shalala

disability pay reforms as overwhelming positive for service members,

which is why they want Congress to apply the changes to all members

being separated as physically or mentally unfit, there are anomalies

to be addressed, they said.

For example, an E-4 with four years' service and a 30-percent rated a

disability that leaves him unfit for duty would get service

disability retirement today of $546.07 a month. Under Dole-Shalala,

if VA compensation remains at current levels, with no qualify-of-life

allowance, the same E-4 injured in war would receive longevity

retirement of $182.02 a month for his four years of service plus VA

compensation of $348. The total of $530.02 a month would be $16 less

than awarded to the non-combat disabled member.

Even in this case, however, VA compensation of $348 a month is only

for the "unfitting" condition. The VA typically will base

compensation for any disabled veteran an average of 20 percent higher

than the rating used for service retirement because the VA considers

all service-connected conditions not just those that make the member

unfit for continued service.

Several military associations and veterans groups met July 31 with

Karen Guice, the Dole-Shalala commission's deputy staff director, to

clarify what commissioners intended regarding two military disability

systems. Retired Air Force Col. Mike Hayden, a benefits expert with

Military Officers Association of America, said Guice assured the

group that commissioners, if asked, would recommend that their

disability pay reforms extend to all disabled members not just the

combat injured.

That seems in keeping with the report's criticism of the confusion

and complexity that now exists with DoD and VA having separate

disability systems. Dole-Shalala would end that dual track, removing

DoD from the rating business. Yet the White House seeks to have

separate disability systems within DoD itself, citing the same

report. This has drawn criticism even within the administration as

concerns rise over the impact on morale of categorizing disabled

members based on where or when they are injured.

President Bush, during an Aug. 13 visit to the VA medical center in

Washington D.C., said the Dole-Shalala recommendations "make a lot of

sense, and we would ask for the Congress to pass those…as quickly as

possible, so I can sign them into law."

http://www.military.com/features/0,15240,146937,00.html

To comment, e-mail milupdate@aol.com, write Military Update, P.O. Box

231111, Centreville, VA, 20120-1111 or visit: www.militaryupdate.com

--end--

Edited August 24, 2007 by Berta

[Pete53]

Many years ago I got a printout of all the money I paid into Social Security and I doubled it to account for the employer contributions. If I remember correctly I got all the money paid back in benefits in just under 5 years.

The point is that more than one third die before they collect more than the death benefit from Social Security and there are a lot who contribute and probably will never see their money.

If this runs its course I think that many here will have to choose between SS and VA or there will be an offset. That is where it is all heading. This Iraq War is going to hurt a lot of people.

Also there are a lot of Americans who have not saved for retirement. What are they going to do with them?

[sixthscents]

I have been yelling about this for years. The Army SEVERANCED me after 16 years, based on "Lumbago"... this after 4 surgeries, an inplanted cortical stimulator and partial paralysis to both legs. The put me out on a "sprained back".... this in 2002.

I read in an article...

"In recent weeks, a separate review group found consistently lower disability ratings by the Army and suggested it might be because officials didn't want to pay benefits. The Army says it is perplexed by the finding but would investigate."

What a crock!... The Army is consistently under rating their injured soldiers to keep down costs... period. They sell you on how you are a team, and an important part of the team etc. etc. etc.

Well I am currently rated at OVER 170% SCHEDULAR by the VA. I am rated at 100% for one single injury that was present at the time I was discharged. In fact all but 1 injury was present, diagnosed, and in my SMR PRIOR to my rating by the Medical Review Board. I filed an appeal, and within 15 minutes it was faxed back - denied... swear to God 15 minutes....

I honestly dont even KNOW what my rating is now by the VA... I am 100% T&P and receive SMC at L1/2 rate... which is probably going up to O in the next bit due to FURTHER complications from the same injuries I had when discharged. Yeah the VA rating was a mass of paperwork, but by God they actually compensated me for my injuries eventually. It took a while to work thru the system, but they did and are providing (In my opinion, and what I have experienced) excellent medical care.... I know that others have had worse experiences, but mine overall has been outstanding compared to the Army's pittance they gave me when I was severanced. Well they TRIED to "recoup" it, (they were taking 20% of my comp each month), but that STOPPED when I received the 100% rating for a service connected injury that the Army denied I was "unfit" for.

I am ashamed of my Army, its not about soldiers its about money. I have seen it again and again... and yet they have the gall to say..."

The Army says it is perplexed by the finding but would investigate"

Bull. They will only change when they are FORCED to change. Until then the soldiers will keep getting a pittance and a hearty handshake...

It makes me sick. "BE ALL YOU CAN BE" until you are broken then you are only going to be the least "unfitting" condition they can find. I can honestly say that I wish I had never served. Maybe I am burned out after seeing them screw the soldiers again and again. It just makes me furious.

I CAN say that however cumbersome and delayed, the VA gets it right more often than not. This is based on what I have seen and is only MY opinion, but even after all the NOD's and appeals they generally in my experience eventually do the "RIGHT" thing.

So.. thats my venting I guess. It's just so.... dishonorable, and I served with honor.... the Army can sit and spin as far as I am concerned. Not the soldiers, nope its the brass... it's POLICY, unstated but fact.... and they'll just keep doing it until congress makes them change. Not our distinguished President... Congress. Bush is going to do everything he can to "appear" that he is addressing this issue, but at ther same time he is going to LIMIT it as much as possible.

Anyway, sorry for the rant... I am just so sick of seeing this... so many many times... and 99% of the time the soldier just accepts it, and files a minor claim with the VA... and accepts their first decision which is flawed because the soldier didnt know how to properly present their case....

Edited August 28, 2007 by sixthscents

[Ricky]

Bob - Glad to see you back. This report completed by Dole and his side kick Shaala really bothers me. It is purported to be the best for the veteran and takes into account him, his family etc..... However,this stop the main portion of VA disability at 65 is just pure bull crap. Did they ever consider that during his younger years he would not be able to work and build a retirement fund for him and his family? No they did not they simply had government savings in their sights. When a soldier gets out after 5,6 or seven years he goes to work. In today's times it is not uncommon for these bright stars to get a job makeing 100 grand or above with excellent retirement bennies. He turns 65 and he has SS and his built up retirement fund - life on easy street. Now these two come along and say we are here to help the veteran. we want to insure that he gets his just benefits. So we want to change the system - we not only want to give him 2600.00 per month for life but we also want to give him another 500.00 just becasue we are good guys. Boy the vet is really rolling in the dough now. That about 36 grand a year is really comparable to his counter part who was not disabled so he should be able to raise his family of 4 really well along with really, really saving for his future retirement. Therefore, since we allowed him the opportunity to live like a king all these years, and build billions of dollars into a retirement fund, we do not feel obligated to pay him past the age of 65 for loss of earnings. Jesus Christ people we gave him 36 grand a year, he should have made his kids go to school naked and saved for retirement. What a bunch of communist idiots these two are. If congress can not see through such a plan then it is time for me to depart this ole place that I love so much. Now if they wanted to give the vet 36 grand a year along with a matching 36 grand in a 401 type retirement fund then we could talk. As it is now their only intention was to save money..............sumbit)(*&^^. May all of their children and grand children suffer from a rare disease that beholds them to the welfare system for their natural lives. Sorry but that is just the way I feel.

I deleted the descriptions Sen Dole and Donna Shalaha. Ricky please keep the personal remarks out of your posts

Edited August 28, 2007 by Pete53

[sixthscents]

Perhaps this is heading to an "offset" of SSD and VA monies... I doubt it would be much of one though... Congress just won't bite. Now, even if they offset all of MY SSD, thay couldn't touch what I get for my daughter I'd be willing to bet...

Personally, I think this is going to boil out to some small bonus, but if they want to try and "back-date" my retirement at 100% to 2002, and slap a reasonable amount of money as "compensation" for pain and suffering well, fine... but I dont see it happening. I think they are going to eventually FORCE the army (they dont deserve a capital A) into accepting the VA's rating as their retirement amount or something....

At least the army's lies and deciet are out in the open now....

Yeah, I am probably offending a bunch of army Retirees and ex Soldiers (notice they do deserve capitals), but I have seen too much. I have seen the army lie, cheat, and underate Honorable men and women for years... so yeah I am mad, and I'm not going to get unmad any time soon. This isnt about our wonderful men and women in uniform... they have been MY heros since I was a child... All I EVER wanted to be was a soldier, and my family was incredibly proud of my serive... it was a tradition, and my Dad was so proud to see me in Dress Blues getting an award... It was the best time in my life, but... the last year was the worst. It was... dirty, and THEIR actions sullied my perception of my service.

With that said... if I could, I'd go back in a second. Crazy and stupid huh? I know, I said I'd wished I never served... well that wasn't entirely true... I just wished that they had lived up to my expectations, and their promises but I will never forget being a soldier, with soldiers... never.

[Chuck75]

First, most Vietnam Vets don't reach full SSA retirement age until 66-67.

I'm also sure that the politicians interested in "saving money" regardless of other considerations have already thought about the veterans & retirees "double dipping" from the military pension, VA compensation, and SSA & SSDI. I'd also bet that the subject comes up again after the next round of elections, regardless of who wins what. There is too long a history of whittling away at military and veteran's benefits, not to mention using a cost of living index for all that is not realistic.

Some of the more notable losses

"Free" Medical care for retirees and dependents.

VA Medical care has a very long way to go as received before it in fact uniformly meets the current care standards on the private side. (And it's been that way since I can remember. It was so bad when I returned from Vietnam (1968) that my family doctors treated the Vietnam related medical problems at no cost or for what the insurance companies would pay, without copay or deductible, rather than have me use the VA.

(This included some corrective surgery.)

The 1/2 compensation payment by the VA

Very low VA mileage compensation.

Medicaid & Medicare drug formulary vs the VA & military formularies.

The influx of foreign trained "doctors" in VA employment. Some/Many? are not considered to be qualified to practice in the state that they are employed by the VA.

SSA disability payments were changed to be taxable under certain circumstances.

I would think this wouldn't stop at the age 65 thing. I would think that if they got that passed - the next thing they would do is to try to prevent vets from drawing both VA and SSD - or offset it - saying that they are already being paid for their inability to work by SSD.

Just a thought

Free

[cowgirl]

I researched this topic on a search engine, using the query "stop VA disability at 65" and encountered the following report. An interesting "take" on disability issues and Page 53 was a Bonus! Its a visual aid for Procedures to Calculate Combined Disability Rating .

www.gao.gov/cgi-bin/getrpt?GAO-06-309 VA Should Improve Its Management of Individual Unemployability Benefits by Strengthening Criteria, Guidance, and Procedures, May 2006

Edited September 1, 2007 by cowgirl