Hard Words From A Shipmate

[allan]

fwd from: VNVets

Tuesday, October 16, 2007

Hard Words from a Shipmate

These are some hard words from a shipmate in the Blue Water Navy Veterans of the Vietnam War. We think it is time they were said.

--------------------------------------------

One of the extremely dangerous affects of the VA winning the Haas case is that, once they have successfully treated the Blue Water Navy as a "sub-class" or "new category" of veteran, essentially legally dividing the whole into parts, they will be able to use that as precedent to pick and choose which veterans get which types of benefits.

Up until this point, all veterans (e.g., combat veterans, POWs, support troops, etc.) fall into the same class and are eligible for all benefits. If the Haas case is ruled in favor of the DVA, they will be able to exclude any veteran from receiving full medical and compensation benefits simply by creating another sub-class of veteran, as they are attempting to do here.

Let me give an example: In the XX War, veterans serving on active duty in combat or combat support would all assume they would receive medical treatment and compensation for injuries sustained in the XX War. But after the XX War is over, the Department of Veteran Affairs could proclaim that any veteran of the XX War who served further than 12 miles from some arbitrary geographical point is not eligible for full veteran benefits, even though the enemy could and did detonate weapons up to 20 miles from the arbitrary point. Those veterans who were injured by those "out of bounds" detonations are, by their own jargon, S.O.L. They will be denied medical care and monetary compensation for any injuries sustained while on active duty during the XX War.

That is exactly what is happening to the Blue Water Navy veterans of the Vietnam War. They are not being given the same medical care and compensation as the troops they supported, fought along side of, and died with. The winning of the Haas case, or the enactment of S-2026, will guarantee that the DVA can create categories of future veterans at whim, and deny them full benefits such as those received by veterans who served within the 12 mile zone from our hypothetical example.

"Impossible!" you might say? It is happening now. It is what the heart of the Haas case and what the S-2026 bill are all about. It is what the Blue Water Navy of the Vietnam War is currently experiencing and has experienced since early 2002. It is not a mere probability - it is current fact.

This situation says to the future United States military member of any branch of service: "Take your chances. Come fight our war. You might or might not receive your medical treatment and combat injury disability payments from the DVA. You won't know until after you've been injured and the War is over. But go ahead, sign on the dotted line." As a veteran of the Vietnam War, my best advice to the youth of America is "Don't play their silly game of Russian Roulette. If these problems are not fixed NOW, stay as far away from service to this Government as you can get. They lie and have no intention of taking care of you if you are injured in battle."

Of course, that's not a hard message to swallow given the current non-treatment and ill-treatment of returning veterans from Iraq and Afghanistan. Even when they claim to be keeping their promise of "We'll take care of you!" the care is so poor and takes so long that it is a national disgrace. This is no longer a Government worth defending. Nonetheless, it is a hard message to give, and I do so only with a very heavy heart and many tears. But this is no longer the Government that I made and kept my pledge of allegiance to. All things change over time, but the principles of Honesty and Integrity must remain constant - and the current leadership of our country has lost touch with those Ideals.

JPR

--------------------------------------------

Our tears join yours, and our heart is also heavy at the perversion of the American Ideal by vain and greedy politicians who talk from both sides of their mouths at once. There are no friends to the American Veteran in the United States Government.

VNVets

"With malice toward none; with charity for all; with firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in; to bind up the nation's wounds; to care for him who shall have borne the battle, and for his widow, and his orphan--to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace, among ourselves, and with all nations." -- President Abraham Lincoln

"Without a decisive naval force we can do nothing definitive, and with it, everything honorable and glorious." --President George Washington

[Berta]

He is right-

dioxin is a persistent organic pollutant with the capability of traveling many miles as it can be airborne as well as remain in any water-

At Danang Vietnam new studies just found that the dioxin level is 300-to 400 times higher that they ever expected.

It has a long 'shelf life' and is still causing damage to the Vietnamese , to their fishing and agri industries and to their health.

This is -next to the VCAA-the most important legislation I have seen in 20 years (next to Nehmer decision too)

If BWVs lose this one- I think the VA will attempt to mess around with ALL AO vets.

If any class of vet or type os service denies those vets in that specific class- then none of us really have any rights at all-

As Mohatma Ghandi said:

'If you discriminate against or limit one segment of a population-you are discriminating against the entire population'-

When I think of this in terms of BWN vets -it is basically the same thing-

Haas -if successful-will cost the VA money- so what-

This is the debt of our Grateful Nation owed to BWVs who have sacrificed their health due to exposure to Agent Orange.

I dont care if Haas costs the VA millions.

They have to honor their mission statement.

We didn't determine that mission statement-they did.

Edited October 18, 2007 by Berta

[Doc John]

fwd from: VNVets

Tuesday, October 16, 2007

Hard Words from a Shipmate

These are some hard words from a shipmate in the Blue Water Navy Veterans of the Vietnam War. We think it is time they were said.

--------------------------------------------

One of the extremely dangerous affects of the VA winning the Haas case is that, once they have successfully treated the Blue Water Navy as a "sub-class" or "new category" of veteran, essentially legally dividing the whole into parts, they will be able to use that as precedent to pick and choose which veterans get which types of benefits.

Up until this point, all veterans (e.g., combat veterans, POWs, support troops, etc.) fall into the same class and are eligible for all benefits. If the Haas case is ruled in favor of the DVA, they will be able to exclude any veteran from receiving full medical and compensation benefits simply by creating another sub-class of veteran, as they are attempting to do here.

Let me give an example: In the XX War, veterans serving on active duty in combat or combat support would all assume they would receive medical treatment and compensation for injuries sustained in the XX War. But after the XX War is over, the Department of Veteran Affairs could proclaim that any veteran of the XX War who served further than 12 miles from some arbitrary geographical point is not eligible for full veteran benefits, even though the enemy could and did detonate weapons up to 20 miles from the arbitrary point. Those veterans who were injured by those "out of bounds" detonations are, by their own jargon, S.O.L. They will be denied medical care and monetary compensation for any injuries sustained while on active duty during the XX War.

That is exactly what is happening to the Blue Water Navy veterans of the Vietnam War. They are not being given the same medical care and compensation as the troops they supported, fought along side of, and died with. The winning of the Haas case, or the enactment of S-2026, will guarantee that the DVA can create categories of future veterans at whim, and deny them full benefits such as those received by veterans who served within the 12 mile zone from our hypothetical example.

"Impossible!" you might say? It is happening now. It is what the heart of the Haas case and what the S-2026 bill are all about. It is what the Blue Water Navy of the Vietnam War is currently experiencing and has experienced since early 2002. It is not a mere probability - it is current fact.

This situation says to the future United States military member of any branch of service: "Take your chances. Come fight our war. You might or might not receive your medical treatment and combat injury disability payments from the DVA. You won't know until after you've been injured and the War is over. But go ahead, sign on the dotted line." As a veteran of the Vietnam War, my best advice to the youth of America is "Don't play their silly game of Russian Roulette. If these problems are not fixed NOW, stay as far away from service to this Government as you can get. They lie and have no intention of taking care of you if you are injured in battle."

Of course, that's not a hard message to swallow given the current non-treatment and ill-treatment of returning veterans from Iraq and Afghanistan. Even when they claim to be keeping their promise of "We'll take care of you!" the care is so poor and takes so long that it is a national disgrace. This is no longer a Government worth defending. Nonetheless, it is a hard message to give, and I do so only with a very heavy heart and many tears. But this is no longer the Government that I made and kept my pledge of allegiance to. All things change over time, but the principles of Honesty and Integrity must remain constant - and the current leadership of our country has lost touch with those Ideals.

JPR

--------------------------------------------

Our tears join yours, and our heart is also heavy at the perversion of the American Ideal by vain and greedy politicians who talk from both sides of their mouths at once. There are no friends to the American Veteran in the United States Government.

VNVets

"With malice toward none; with charity for all; with firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in; to bind up the nation's wounds; to care for him who shall have borne the battle, and for his widow, and his orphan--to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace, among ourselves, and with all nations." -- President Abraham Lincoln

"Without a decisive naval force we can do nothing definitive, and with it, everything honorable and glorious." --President George Washington

Dear JP,

I am affraid your assessment of the high beaurocracy may be right on. How can they exclude those veterans who were injured in the line of duty- no matter where that duty led them. Blue water, red dirt, rice paddy or cloudy sky, a disabled military veteran is the same.

Doc John

[rthomass]

I am in total agreement with the statement. Our Government both Democrats and Republicans have no idea or do they care about integrity and justice let alone the Consatitution of The United States of America. I love my Country but frankly our leaders are arrogant self serving SOB's.

[john999]

Since none of our leaders or their children will be called upon to actually go to a place like Iraq or Vietnam it is easy for them to spout off about supporting the troops and "fallen heros". Who wants to be a fallen hero or a wounded hero? Nobody wants a PH or a KIA by their name. I just wish I could tell the young dudes not to sign those papers. How many college students are dropping out to join the infantry?

[Berta]

Guys-you know who this vet is-

I interviewed him live at

http://www.stardustent.com/

Just go to the ink and click on the SVR link on the left

and the show is in archives under Sept 12th.

JR gave a compelling interview as to Blue Water veterans issues.

And please access the BWN site and the link to his new forum.

[gdsnide]

fwd from: VNVets

Tuesday, October 16, 2007

Hard Words from a Shipmate

These are some hard words from a shipmate in the Blue Water Navy Veterans of the Vietnam War. We think it is time they were said.

--------------------------------------------

One of the extremely dangerous affects of the VA winning the Haas case is that, once they have successfully treated the Blue Water Navy as a "sub-class" or "new category" of veteran, essentially legally dividing the whole into parts, they will be able to use that as precedent to pick and choose which veterans get which types of benefits.

Up until this point, all veterans (e.g., combat veterans, POWs, support troops, etc.) fall into the same class and are eligible for all benefits. If the Haas case is ruled in favor of the DVA, they will be able to exclude any veteran from receiving full medical and compensation benefits simply by creating another sub-class of veteran, as they are attempting to do here.

Let me give an example: In the XX War, veterans serving on active duty in combat or combat support would all assume they would receive medical treatment and compensation for injuries sustained in the XX War. But after the XX War is over, the Department of Veteran Affairs could proclaim that any veteran of the XX War who served further than 12 miles from some arbitrary geographical point is not eligible for full veteran benefits, even though the enemy could and did detonate weapons up to 20 miles from the arbitrary point. Those veterans who were injured by those "out of bounds" detonations are, by their own jargon, S.O.L. They will be denied medical care and monetary compensation for any injuries sustained while on active duty during the XX War.

That is exactly what is happening to the Blue Water Navy veterans of the Vietnam War. They are not being given the same medical care and compensation as the troops they supported, fought along side of, and died with. The winning of the Haas case, or the enactment of S-2026, will guarantee that the DVA can create categories of future veterans at whim, and deny them full benefits such as those received by veterans who served within the 12 mile zone from our hypothetical example.

"Impossible!" you might say? It is happening now. It is what the heart of the Haas case and what the S-2026 bill are all about. It is what the Blue Water Navy of the Vietnam War is currently experiencing and has experienced since early 2002. It is not a mere probability - it is current fact.

This situation says to the future United States military member of any branch of service: "Take your chances. Come fight our war. You might or might not receive your medical treatment and combat injury disability payments from the DVA. You won't know until after you've been injured and the War is over. But go ahead, sign on the dotted line." As a veteran of the Vietnam War, my best advice to the youth of America is "Don't play their silly game of Russian Roulette. If these problems are not fixed NOW, stay as far away from service to this Government as you can get. They lie and have no intention of taking care of you if you are injured in battle."

Of course, that's not a hard message to swallow given the current non-treatment and ill-treatment of returning veterans from Iraq and Afghanistan. Even when they claim to be keeping their promise of "We'll take care of you!" the care is so poor and takes so long that it is a national disgrace. This is no longer a Government worth defending. Nonetheless, it is a hard message to give, and I do so only with a very heavy heart and many tears. But this is no longer the Government that I made and kept my pledge of allegiance to. All things change over time, but the principles of Honesty and Integrity must remain constant - and the current leadership of our country has lost touch with those Ideals.

JPR

--------------------------------------------

Our tears join yours, and our heart is also heavy at the perversion of the American Ideal by vain and greedy politicians who talk from both sides of their mouths at once. There are no friends to the American Veteran in the United States Government.

VNVets

"With malice toward none; with charity for all; with firmness in the right, as God gives us to see the right, let us strive on to finish the work we are in; to bind up the nation's wounds; to care for him who shall have borne the battle, and for his widow, and his orphan--to do all which may achieve and cherish a just and lasting peace, among ourselves, and with all nations." -- President Abraham Lincoln

"Without a decisive naval force we can do nothing definitive, and with it, everything honorable and glorious." --President George Washington

OK..I joined the Navy 12 days after I was 17 in 1964 & I thought all those guys running off to Canada were a bunch of punks.But, the more I learn I sometimes wonder if they weren't a little smarter than me. ha GARY