Ao Blue Waters Sue Secretary Shinseki

[Berta]

http://www.salem-news.com/articles/august032013/blue-water-suit-jpr.php

The Blue Water Navy Vietnam Veterans Association, (BWNVVA) (our president John Rossie has done many SVR shows here as well as Commander Wells too, I think , who is the attorney quoted below) and Military-Veterans Advocacy (MVA) , have sued Eric Shinseki.

Blue Water Navy Veterans Sue Secretary of Veterans Affairs Eric Shinseki for Failure to Grant Disability Benefits

In part:

“Attorney John Wells, who brought the suit, is a retired Navy Commander and served as Chief Engineer on three Navy ships. “I am very familiar with the naval operations at the time and the distillation equipment that enriched the dioxin.” Wells said. “We have taken this evidence to two separate committees of the Institute of Medicine, and they agree that the distillation process, based on Henry’s law of thermodynamics, would have co-distilled and enriched the dioxin. This confirmed an earlier study by the University of Queensland.” Wells is the Executive Director of MVA and previously serves as Director of Legal and Legislative Affairs for the BWNVVA. After retiring as a surface warfare officer he opened a law practice in Slidell Louisiana with emphasis on military and veterans law. “

[john999]

Can you go on record as having filed an AO claim without the VA attempting to work it?

[stillhere]

John999,

I first filed a claim for my hearing loss in 1984 because I was having trouble hearing and I knew without a doubt it was from my time in service.

I then like most of us went on with my life buying my aids and paying out of my pocket for everything because back then insurance did not cover it. I started hearing about the AO problems in vets lets say in the late 80's from news reports that their was going to be a class action and vets were dying! I personal did not have those problems back then so I did not file.

I am a member of AL so I kind of kept my ear to the ground and when I heard/read that AO was having DB2 connected to it. I actually called my brother because his DB2 was real bad and told him he should file. He did and is currently something like 60% for that alone. Anyhow I was starting to have problems with it too so I filed about a year later after I was dx with DB2 and was granted at 40%. My heart disease which Berta helped me with a few years back was connected to my DB2 before any mention of it being a presumptive.

Now I am 64 and I have all kinds of this and that and sometimes think I am going to die tomorrow. I hope I have answered your question . Kind of forgot what it was there for a minute.

Do I believe that everything is connected to AO ? well the numbers are there for most of what congress and the AMC has determined YES. But I believe in science and the numbers. They have to lead me there, just like it has with AO, the numbers and the science were there.

It appears that you and many hear on this site like to advocate to file for anything for the future. I guess we will just have to disagree on this.

Stillhere

[harleyman]

STILHERE said... Are not these claims adding to the back up and causing Veterans of today with legit claims suffering even longer to get their deserved benefits.

If BW vets want to go on record as having made a claim then fine but to actually have the VA working them is a waste of time!

These claims of throw it on the wall and see if it sticks hurts all of us! Almost like being an investor in stock market future!

They used to say the same thing about the Vietnam veteran's claims were a waste of time to file for DMII and heart, and all the rest of the presumptive conditions. If the RVN Veterans had not filed their claims (some may have called them a waste of time) the studies would never have been done and you and I would never have received anything for our illnesses realted to AO. It's because there were alot of men and women before us that filed thier claim and that's why we are where we are now as far as service connected presumptive compensation.

Vietnam Veterans waited longer and still wait longer than any other group to get their claims decisions. I personally believe, if a blue water Veteran believes his medical condition is due to AO then he should file his claim. It's their right to do so. I would not belittle their effort to recieve compensation by implying thier claims are not ligitimate and they are keeping others for getting theirs. The average number of conditions for WWII, Vietnam, Korea war vets is usually about 2 to 6 conditions. The aveerage claim for OEF/OIF Vets is about 20 to 40 issues. GWOT Vets list every condition ever listed in their STRS becuase the computer tracks everything. Which is something no other veteran before them have had in their arsenal with the VA. It is their entire electronic list of issues, whether the condition bothers them or not. A Blue Water Vet claim for AO exposure for diabetes is one maybe up to 4 issues.

Filing a claim for benefits due to illness, is nothing like being an investor in the stock market. If there are studies that support BW veterans have been exposed and the studies are legit, then they have just as much entitlement to benefits and medical care as any other service member.

There was a post here earlier today where GWOT veterans are being GIVEN a years retroactive pay simply for filing a FCD claim as thier initial claim. ANd how is that fair to those who have been waiting for a decision who file a regular claim 1+ year ago. I don't see those Veteran's getting interest on their money they have had to wait for. But now GWOT Vets get special treatment. I believe Blue water Veterans have as much right to file a claim as anyone else and should make a statement by doing so. -and yes I stand by this opinion

Gulf War veterans I respect you and your work. You are honorable and rightgeous. You deserve every thing you can from our country and the VA for your service. But, others have paved the way, which has made it better for you. The Vietnam Veterans deserve our respect and admiration just for persevering. I will fight for all Veterans to be treated as fairly and expiditiously as possible in the claim battle with VA.

Edited August 6, 2013 by harleyman

[Stretch]

Yes, numbers do count. Other countries that served in VN navies have at least done studies that are not concerned with corruption or money.

The initial toxicology report found that distilling seawater concentrated the dioxins in the water navy personnel were drinking and washing in to above safe levels. The report was an attempt to explain why more navy personnel were dying after the war than other veterans.

http://www.2ndbattalion94thartillery.com/Chas/AgentOrangeShipboard.htm

Edited August 6, 2013 by Stretch

[Stretch]

Here is some facts for those who are interested in Blue Water Vets.

Everybody doesn't know anything, but if a person says it enough then they may come to believe what they are saying. This is what the VA does Here is some information on VN Vets 2009 from a researcher:

http://winoverptsd.com/wp/some-interesting-statistics-on-vietnam-veterans/#more-386

• Total Number of Veterans Deployed to Southeast Asia at the End of the Vietnam War:

OVER 3, 403,100!!

• Total Number “in-country” (boots on the ground) 2, 594,000.
• Total Number “off-shore” Blue Water Navy: 514,300.
• Current estimate of Vietnam Veterans still living: (less than) 850,000.
• Total Number of Vietnam Era Veterans Receiving Compensation: 1,015,410.
• Total Number of Vietnam War Veterans Who Died Between 2000 and 2007: 490,135.
• Potential Number of “off-shore” Vietnam War Vets Still Living: 168,525.
• Potential Number of TLC (Thailand, Laos, Cambodia) Still Living: 96,600.

Here is the bill before congress stating that says it is all about money.

The Blue Water Navy Vietnam Veterans Act was introduced to the House Floor by Rep. Chris Gibson (D-NY) along with 41 strongly bipartisan initial co-sponsors on February 6, 2013. This legislation will return the presumption of exposure to herbicide to Navy and Marine veterans who served in the off shore waters of Vietnam. HR-543 now replaces HR-3612, which was the number used by the previous 112th Congress. The wording is the same, but the new designating number is HR-543.

The Senate Companion Bill to HR-543 will be introduced by Senator Gillibrand to the Senate Floor with a currently unknown but growing number of bipartisan co-sponsors sometime before the end of February. In the last Congressional Session, this Bill was numbered as S-1629, but it will be assigned a new number when it is re-introduced. Again, the wording of the new Bill should be the same as S-1629. In the 112th Congress, HR-3612 and S-1629 were identically worded.

Those Bills in the 112th Congress were supported by nearly 35 Veteran and Military Organizations including the unanimous approval of all 28 members of The Military Coalition.

What held this Bill from being released from Committee during the last 112th Congress was the lack of a CBO Score – a cost figure provided by the Congressional Budget Office. A preliminary cost estimate was finally released the second week of October, 2012, too late in the session for any action to be taken on the legislation before that Congress adjourned. That preliminary cost estimate should be finalized by the CBO before the end of February also.

Here is a documentary:

http://abclocal.go.com/wtvd/story?section=news/abc11_investigates&id=6395910

Studies by the Centers for Disease Control in Atlanta show that cancer incidence rates are actually higher in sailors who served in the navy than soldiers with boots on the ground during Vietnam.

Edited August 7, 2013 by Stretch

[john999]

I never even got an exit physical, nor any copies of my records when I was discharged. My medical records are a joke. 6 months of out patient psychiatric records are missing. All records of medical for basic training are missing where I complained about knee pain and foot pain . I went for exam for severe jaw pain and Army dentist did not even document it. He told me there was no treatment for TMJ, so my records are silent on that. I wish I had filed for every little thing when I got out because all those things have come back to haunt me now. I filed one claim in 1972 and did not file a different claim until I filed for DMII due to AO back in 2005. The AO exam doctor identified three conditions that were likely AO related in 1999, but that is not the same as claiming them.