diabetes Ssdi Onset Date Has Me Confused.

[kluender]

Yesterday, I received a letter from Social Security. Topic: Supplemental Security Income Notice. It states, "We have found that you meet the medical requirements for disability benefits. An explanation of our finding is attached.....We have not yet mad a decision about whether you meet the non-medical requirements...."

While overjoyed that my case has come this far and so fast, the part that I'm concerned about is the onset date. My application states that I stopped working March 3rd, 2010, which would be my alleged onset date. I received 100% total and permanent disability from VA in October, 2010.

Conditions listed on the Social Security Administration Explanation of Determination are:

Anxiety

Depression

Memory loss

Ankles problems

Diabetes

Intervertebral disc syndrome

Paralysis of the sciatic nerve

Pes planus

Plantar fasciitis

Urinary incontinence

It then reads, "While you may have experienced symptoms related to these as early as 03/04/10, you did not meet the SSA disability requirements at that time. Based on the evidence in your file, the earliest date that you met the requirements for disability was 04/04/14. Prior to that time, the limitation by condition would not have prevented you from returning to doing all types of work. Therefore we have established an onset date for your disability as of 04/04/14."

From 03/03/10 until present, my condition hasn't changed except for being down graded from 50% to 30% for depression in 2010, prior to receiving 100% from VA in Oct, 2010. I know that if I appeal, my case can be reviewed and I could be denied SSDI. Does anyone have any idea why my onset date would be 04/04/2014? The only thing significant about that date for me is that it's birthday. So far, I haven't used a lawyer.

Should I be concerned that the subject of the notice reads, "Supplemental Security Income", instead of, "Supplemental Security Disability Income"?

Thanks for your help.

[jbasser]

No,In some cases the first check is usually SSI which is a temporary thing until the system is updated.

It may not hurt to ask for an earlier effective date from VA,. Their definition of disability is not as strong as SSA.

J

[Barbamatt]

Usually the date of onset of a disability is the last day you worked. Sometimes they assign a date. When I went to court the judge didn't agree with the date I claimed and asked me to amend the date to a later time in order to receive a favorable decision.

Sometimes you have to accept a later date to get a decision in your favor...it is SS way to pay you less....but getting a decision is sometimes better than fighting it.

[jbasser]

The SSA effective date carries some serious weight with VA onset dates.

J

[kluender]

Barbamatt, are you saying that the onset date is sometimes just an arbitrary date that they select? I haven't worked in over 4 years with hardly any changes to my health.

Jbasser, I received 100% VA disability effective October, 2010. How would it help to get an earlier date?

Thanks to both of you for responding.

[Berta]

I agree with Barbamatt's point. Good for you Barbamatt for challenging the date. We never know what can happen if we dont try, but you are right that the last day of work is not always but often the SSA date they use.

Many years ago my husband got a SSA award solely for a NSC stroke. The NSC stroke ,which happened in 1992) became a 1151 stroke in 2012.

At that time however, we considered his major disability to be PTSD and this is what he filed the SSDI application for.,adding the stroke info.

When he got the SSDI award I called them up asking what about his SC PTSD (at 30% at that time)

and they said they never considered it as the stroke was totally disabling.

I went to Corning SSA office and asked their permission to check out their regulations. (no internet search available in those days).

After a few miserable hours going through stacks of SSA regulations I found what I needed... a regulation that states SSA will consider ALL disabilities you claim.

I xeroxed it and we asked them for a reconsideration form.

SSA really tried to talk my husband and me out of filing this form.They suggested it could even involve him losing his SSDI.

Of course with PTSD and brain damage he got scared when they said that. I didnt and I prepared the form and he signed it and we mailed it in.

3 months later SSA called him and said they had awarded solely for PTSD with an EED of Oct 1991.(the last day he worked)

They also said they had declared him incompetent but he could challenge that but he said he liked being declared incompetent.

His SSDI retro for the PTSD was over 17,000 and more importantly , he had a PTSD claim in for higher rating then the 30%.

Unfortunately he died 3 years before the VA awarded him posthumously for the 100% P & T for PTSD,to me as an accrued benefit. The EED VA gave him was 1991, per the SSDI PTSD award.

I mentioned this before but it pays to mention again.

We had asked a SSA lawyer to support the reconsideration request and he said it would fail and wouldn't help us.

But he was pretty attentive when I called him up and told him he just lost about 4500 bucks.(whatever 25% would have been as his SSA fee)

He was stunned about that and we had a long talk and he told me he would never look at a PTSD veteran the same way again.

The evidence of my husband's 100% PTSD came from many sources in addition to his VA psychiatric records.

I dont know the time frame for asking for a Reconsideration at SSDI these days but that info should be at their web site.

[Philip Rogers]

It sounds to me like SSA is trying to save money, by short changing you on the onset date. There should be no reason for them to consider SSI, as you receive too much money, from VA, to be considered for SSI. I would wait for their decision, on SSDI, and if they don't award the March 3, 2010, onset date, I would appeal the decision. jmo

pr

[jbasser]

Barbamatt, are you saying that the onset date is sometimes just an arbitrary date that they select? I haven't worked in over 4 years with hardly any changes to my health.

Jbasser, I received 100% VA disability effective October, 2010. How would it help to get an earlier date?

Thanks to both of you for responding.

The Date you stopped working could be your effective date. sounds like 6 months or retro to me.

[Barbamatt]

In my case they gave me an onset date two months after I stopped working. The judge thought that I earned too much money during the period of time I claimed to have worked in 2012...I agreed to the date he recommended in order to receive my fully favorable decision. I risked him granting me a partially favorable decision with the date changed anyway or a denial.

Sometimes the judge thinks that you may have been able to work past the last day you worked or they just don't agree with the date. For whatever reason they will set a new date that is later than the date that you stopped working. It may seem arbitrary...I can not say if that is the case...but it seems like it sometimes.

For me I accepted the later date, for two reasons. One he ruled in my decision on the spot if I agreed to amend it there...and two it was only 2 months...I felt that I had more to lose to fight it than to accept it...I can't tell you what to do.

If you accept the later date you give up some money, but if it means that you win your case, you might be better off....but if it is going to put a financial hardship on you it might be worth appealing.

[broncovet]

Barbamatt and Berta have given you good advice. Each Veteran, and each SSDI will choose whether to accept the onset date (effective date) or appeal it. Our government loves to take a long time with the process and then boink us on the dates when/if they finally do an award. You, too, will need to chose whether or not to appeal your onset date.

It sounds like the dispute involves 4 years or so of retro, so its likely worth your time to take it to an attorney and see about appealing the onset date.

Remember, tho, as Berta correctly pointed out, attorneys often find a "market niche" and they may or may not include "appealing effective dates" in their area of expertise, so you may need to find an attorney who specializes in or at least has knowledge of appealing onset dates.

The other attorney's may just tell you to forget it. Remember, attorney's love to "skim the cream" and look for cases where they make millions and poo poo cases where the potential is only 40 grand or so. You may just need to find a hungrier attorney, but you wont find him if you dont bother to look.

[kluender]

Thanks to everyone who responded. I chose to appeal the onset date and am now waiting for an answer. While researching my case, I just happened to look at my Social Security account online and found that my SSDI was approved. I will receive my first check November 12th, 2014, which will come in handy to help my disabled sister until she receives hers. I'm keeping my fingers crossed for the retro though. Thanks again!

[Snake Eyes]

The intake person at Social Security worked with me to determine that I had worked more than 13 hours a month during my "under employment years" and thus did not qualify for SSDI during that time. As a result, the onset date was set to 6/30/2014. If the case goes in my favor, would I be paid beginning January, 2015 or would there be retro pay back to the onset date?

[Buck52]

I Understand the on set date can be when you first became disable but continue to work under certain conditions until you just could not stand or walk (certain previsions apply)

example say your Dr render you disable in 2012 but you continue to work until 2014 under certain conditions and had to stop working completely because your disability under certain conditions or not... the onset date can be the 2012 date.

but you have to have medical rational to back it up....or medical evidence that meet SSA rules.

source :SSA RULES ABOUT ON SET DATES!

...................Buck

[Buck52]

Date of Disability

The second and more important factor regarding when a person's disability starts is the onset date of their disability -- that is, when their disability began. When an SSD claimant files an application for disability benefits, they indicate (on the application) when they think their disability began. This is known as the alleged onset date, or AOD.

A disability claimant who has been approved for benefits will be given an EOD, or "established" onset date. The established onset date is set by a DDS disability examiner, or an administrative law judge (if your case has gone to hearing), and is considered to be the date for when a claimant's disability actually began.The EOD will be based entirely on the claimant's medical records and work history. In other words, how far back an individual's disability is determined to have began will be decided according to the evidence available from the claimant's doctor's reports, lab results, and disability application.

For SSI, the date of disability is often before the application date, but the SSA won't set an EOD before the date of application (since SSI recipients can't get benefits before the month of application). In the case that the SSA says the EOD is after the application date, the SSI recipient would start to get benefits starting on the EOD rather than the month following the application.

For SSDI, whether or not benefits will be payable back to the beginning of the 12-month retroactive period time will depend on the onset date that is established, either by a disability examiner or by an administrative law judge. But there is another twist in calculating the SSDI starting date: a waiting period.

[Buck52]

Onset Date of Disability

Question 10 says “Enter the date you became unable to work because of your illness, injuries, or conditions.” This date is called your alleged onset date, the date that you claim your disability began. The onset date is important and will affect how much backpay (retroactive benefits) you will receive if you claim is approved. The earlier your onset date, the more backpay you'll get. (For more information, see our articles about disability back payments.)

If your disability began with a specific incident like a car accident, then this may be an easy question for you to answer. However, if your disability is caused by one or more illnesses that have worsened gradually over time, then the question will probably be difficult. Most people have never tried to remember the date they became disabled. The date of disability is usually considered to be when your medical condition started to make you unable to do your job effectively.

If you have never thought about when you became disabled, sit down with a calendar or talk with friends or family to jog your memory about the history of your disability. For example, it may be that you were diagnosed with fibromyalgia in October 2009 while you were still employed, but the illness worsened over time and resulted in some poor job performance. Friends and family may be able to help you remember when the illness impaired your ability to work, and that would be your onset date.

Another source of information that can help you establish your onset date is treatment providers (the doctors and hospitals you've visited). If you became disabled while you were seeing a medical provider, requesting and reviewing those medical records may help you pinpoint your onset date.

Details of Your Disability