ptsd Am I The Legal Surviving Spouse/widow Of Deceased Disbled Vet?

[Guest Gail]

I need help. This is kinda confusing, but I will try to explain. I married my now deceased husband the first time while he was in the military, 02-12-1971. We lived in my home state of Georgia. He suffered from 100% disability for PTSD from Vietnam. Ok..we divorced from our cerimonial marriage of 2-12-1971 due to his constant infidelity. BUT.. PRIOR to the divorce hearing we had reconcilled and I obtained the divorce anyway, and on the day our divorce was final, we formed a common law marriage which in Georgia as it was prior to 01-97 it is legal, and there had to be a divorce to end it. We carried on our lives as the usual married couple would. Nothing changed. We lived as husband and wife, presented as husband and wife and we did everything as husband and wife. We met all the criteria for legal common law married couples.

In Mid 1982, he deserted me due to his infidelity, and when the affair ended, He went back to his home state of Wisconsin in August of 1982. He told me he would take care of the divorce up there. He kept in touch with me thru all these years, and assured me we were divorced and he would send me the papers, 'when he found his copy'. Meanwhile, he remarries 3 times in WI, and has 2 children by a second marriage in Wisconsin, and was 'married' to #3 up there when he died. I remarried because I was pregnant, divorced my child's father and remarried him again. I have been divorced for 13 years from my childs dad.

I found out since I had not heard from him for several months, from his mom in WI, that on 06-28-01 he passed away. I was grief stricken and still am. About a year or so after I found about his death, I was curious as to when he divorced me in WI. I had a record search done. HE NEVER DIVORCED ME FROM OUR LEGAL COMMON LAW MARRIAGE. This means that neither of us were free to enter into any kind of marriage due to the fact that we were still married to each other. My marriages are not valid nor was any of his.

This has turned my world, and my daughters upside down. His mom talked me into applying for DIC.

I have sent in statements from his dad, (now deceased), his mom and his sister, along with statements from my sisters and some of our friends verifying that we lived as husband and wife, held ourselves out to be husband and wife and presented ourselves as married in every way. I even sent a statement from the man that owned a house we rented while we were in the common law marriage. Needless to say I am having fits from the VA. I sent in all this in July 2004, and after being told they never received it, sent it again, and still was told they didn't have it, questioned any claim for I was to do, was told nothing and I don't know who read all the info I sent in, but you would think they got their info from a completely different source than what I said, and they denied my claim. I sent in a disagreement letter. I had to beg for the form 21-5 something, and sent it, they denied getting it..I have sent 3 and still don't know. The Atlanta VA office says they cannot help me for the VA represented the 'other wife' and told me to use the VSO office here in Gainesville, and I did, and called and told them I had signed the power of attorney, within the 60 day period they gave me. I want and need representation. NOW GET THIS...I called the VA back and they told me that the VSO could not represent me because it was a part of the VA that had represented the 'other wife'...WHAT DO I DO? I spoke with a Mr. Gilmer here that is head of some Viet Vet thing state wide, I think, I explained it all to him and he said I had a case, that I was still legally married to my dead husband until he died, and not to give up. I have heard nothing more, received no more forms, not any kind of help nothing, and the power of attorney was mailed this July. So, who am I? Common sense tells me I am his widow, and this mess is awful. I meet all the VA requirements for surviving spouse, and can even use the continous cohabitation requirement, as he deserted me due to infidelity and I had no part in the separation,

SO WHAT DO I DO? Is there anyone out here that can help me? I am disabled now, and the 'other wife' quit her job and is not working and has been living with another man since 3 months after the death of the veteran. HELP, please!!!! Is this clear to anyone out there? Seems I was an unwilling bigamist. I guess I should have pressed more for the papers or check for myself. The deceased was in the process of going to divorce the 'other wife' and move back to GA but he died before he could.

[Guest Gail]

to 10: Well I see you do have a touch of human emotion. Do you not think I am very aware that 'the man is dead'?

As it being my cross to bear and laying it on my child: Was I supposed to lie to her about the phone calls she heard, and not tell her the truth as to what was happening, and the reasons why? I don't know if you have children, or what your relationship is, but my child is 20 years old, and knew of our marriage and the things, and she said she wished I had taken her and left. You have no understanding of this situation. The truth may not always be beautiful, but the truth is in everything. Why should I have lied to her questions and then have her find out down the road that I had lied to her. Does that make sense to you, I guess not.

I have friends here that served in Nam and have PTSD and I am glad yours is not from the war. Again, how can you say about the things he revealed to me that he would not have. You were not here in our lives, you don't know, and you cannot potentially call me a liar when I state such. As long as I know what I am talking about, your statement means nothing to me. You can make no calls on how things were with us. How can you even go as far at to catagorize him as 'tipical' Every is different yet alike with PTSD from the war. It was only recently when a friend of mine that in the army and did tdy at a base near me, as crew chief on a chopper, came to GA this year for the ATL 500 from California, and we got together with 2 more friends from the military post that married women here, and we all were friends, that one revealed to me during one of the get togethers during the visit, that had it not been for the group of people here that welcomed him and befriended him, and cared about him, that he would have blown his brains out. He told me he thanked us for saving his life. The two here whom I have known since before I knew my dead husband (yes husband, whether you like it or not), also suffer from PTSD. If you never experienced the Vietnam war then it is different.

Why did it take me this long? Well his mom and dad had been pushing me. I really didn't think about us being still married, I just wanted to see if the date of the divorce he told me he obtained was correct when I found out there was not one. I only discovered this in the latter part of 2003, and his now deceased dad, as of last August, and his mom and sister and brother kept on until they convinced me to do it. You cannot do the right thing until you know a wrong thing has been done and you cant change what had happened, because he was not alive to get it set right with. I was told by his mom that nobody could live up to his expectations of a wife, as I was. Everyone he dated or married was told about me, and knew he and I were in contact. As a matter of fact, I had posted some info trying to find anyone he had served with in Nam to a board last year and I got an e-mail from a woman in WI who mailed me and described him, and asked if his brother name was Norm. she said if so, she would like to chat with me. We did and spoke on the phone.

She knew all about me, and had been engaged to him, and we conversed about him and she spoke of him as being on and off his meds, and the difference.

Did I ever state that I couldn't trust him? Admittedly he hurt me terribly with things, but I would not think that he would have done this as it would have an effect on his life had I questioned and checked while he was living. That is why. Divorce by publication, and he could have told them he didn't know where I was or told them I lived in Atlanta somewhere and it would have been published in that newspaper. How can I say because I don't know. I don't know if he had done it what he would have said. I was not there.

So I didn't care enough to find out when he was alive? I just blindly accepted the date he gave me.

It was not I who remarried first, oh enlightened one. I had one wild dream didn't I, you jerk. You have a rampant imagination. You think it is about the money? Well then you need to double up on your meds ole boy. I am sure that his parents, my living sisters, our friends we had down here, the person who owned the house we lived in after the conception of our common law marriage, have just all lied about everything.

As far as the LAW is concerned, ole boy, whether you like it or not, we met all the criteria and our marriage

WAS LEGAL. So, what can be done about that law? Just skate around it. I was made an unwilling bigamist, as he was the willing bigamist. But, as he is now deceased and I have been divorced from my child's father for 13 years, and have not remarried since his passing in 2001, I am not that anymore. Oh yes, oh learned one, I needed all this confusion and blow up in my life...I have already admitted I was naieve and stupid for accepting what he told me as true and the supposed date of our divorce. Wanna shoot me for this? I would imagine you have never believed anyone and what you were told turned out to be a lie...you one lucky man if that has happened.

If I could say what I really feel about your statement about it being about the money that I would not care about anything, but I cannot put it out here on this board due to the posting rules. You should really set up business as mind reader and know it all. As the saying goes, 'You know everything about everything, but know shit about anything." Last time I checked you and I both still retain the wonderful gift of freedom of speech. You have your 'opinions' and you are free to state them in however condescending, nasty manner you choose, but you surely know the statement about 'opinions'. You are truly ignorant and I dont know what happened to you in your life to have you be this way, but God Bless you ole boy. What I know as truth, and what those who matter know as truth and what God knows as truth is the only thing that means anything to me. Perhaps you need to sit down and have a word with the man above before you start slinging out your 'judgement'.

About signing the divorce papers? Had you have read all of my posts and explanations you would surely have picked up on that. You need to go back and get the history, then if you dont understand, I will explain it to you in perhaps a way you can? OK???? So now you know how I felt, and know I admitted 'moving on'

You have no clue ole boy as to whether I 'moved on' from any feelings or love or anything. I would say that the poor 'grieving #3 real wife" as you put her, moved on really quickly, as she was dragging men into his home within weeks of his death, and was living with one since he was gone 3 months, and is still living with him' Now if that is not moving on with a quickness, I don't know what is. He lived next to his mom and dad. I know things that were told to me by my HUSBAND and his mother(the 'merry widow told his mom this about their marriage), that you have no clue. Do you have a problem with the fact that we always remained close, and I had a very good relationship with his parents since 1971? Or that they love me as their daughter in law or what? You have definately some issues with yourself you should deal with.

Thank you for your condolences for the loss of my legal husband and myself. Can you really say 'dragged thru the mud? I think it could be said she made her own mud hole and wallowed in it. From the one conversation I had with her...she knew about this whole mess prior to the marriage...and she certainly grieved didnt she? Maybe when you pass, and wind up cremated when it was known you didnt want it, and be flung in the closet while ya grieving supposed widow, is living with another man you would really like it, and your family too. Wanna talk about being for the money? She quit working so she could draw whatever she gets, and lives with her boyfriend, but won't remarry cause she would loose the benefits..Statement from her mouth. Now what did I hear about money? I am not the one in it for the money ole boy. You are so full of it you stink you know. This is not what this board is about, if you want to sling some mud and get down and dirty and go at it nose to nose, do so by personal e-mail- not out here, for this is not what this if for. I tell it like it is too ole boy. So if you would like to persue this 'pis---g match' do so in private mail to me. This is a board for help and most anything else I think but for what you are doing. I really don't think I am even going to dignify any more of your idiotic, unresearched, mud slinging at me posts any more. you seem as tho you are on a mission to make me cry and to minimize what has happened and you succeeded in making me cry, but until you stand in my shoes, know the truth and all the facts..you bet just put a muzzle on it ole boy. You dont have a clue.

God bless your old crazy self.

[Guest Gail]

To 10:

Thank you for your last post. Perhaps now you might realize this I loved him very much, and I know he loved me very much as well, that's why I tried so hard for so very many years. I am sorry to hear about your suffering, but we all want to be able to trust the ones we love. As I said before PTSD makes one do things they are not really responsible for and would not have done. I held on thru all the promises and infidelities in my life with him, and hoped that If I were not there as I always was to try and soften his world and forgive him he would seek the help he so desperately needed. Things happened as they did and I cannot change them. I loved him just as much thru all of this and even now, as I did the day I married him.

Hopefully someday you will understand. The love was always there, even to the end. My grief is just as fresh as it was when I found out about his death, and his mom could not contact me for she forgot my phone number was still listed in our married name and was the same, but she was in shock and grief at loosing her son. I would have been there in a heart beat.

May God help you thru your private hell and bless you and your family.

Gail

[wallyg]

Just to inject an impartial voice of reason into this;

Common Law marriages exist in many States and countries, but the laws are different almost everywhere.

The definitions and circumstances of what constitutes a legal 'common law' marriage have many variations; as do the laws on what legally satisfies the 'termination' of the marriage.

Personally, I have never heard of a 'divorce' requirement, but unless I took the time to research the Georgia law on the matter, I would certainly NOT categorize anybody as a liar, on the basis of personal feelings. If you have doubts about the veracity of members posts, then either research them, or ignore them.

DO NOT AFFRONT MEMBERS, WITHOUT SOLID EVIDENCE.

[10thFO]

To Gail, I will apologize if I got to meanspirited in my reply to you. There are always two sides to every story and I didn't let you have your say.

[Guest Gail]

To 10: Thank you, I accept your apology and extend my hand in friendship as I though I alread have. Lives get complicated, you make decisions in life that at the time seem to be the only thing you can do, and things don't turn out as you thought it would. We all do many things for reasons that most others would not understand. As you know, a relationship is hard to maintain when PTSD has its ugly grip on it. You both feel helpless and do a lot of crying. You were right in my trusting him to have been truthful. It's all a mess and as I stated, I have researched many many hours on all aspects of the common law marriage intrinsics every where, and I have been quite educated on a lot I didn't know. I have read military stuff on that would concern all of this and tried to make sense out of it.

Like I said, God Bless you and you hang in there and give it all you got to overcome and deal with the demons in your being. I hope you find your peace before escaping only to death.

Gail

[Guest Gail]

To Wally: You are exactly right on in your statement. I agree with you on the different states that allow common law marriages, there are different requirements for the marriage to be considered legal. The one thing I found that in every state, whether the marriage was legally contracted there, or accepted as legal in a state that does not recognize the formation of such marriage inside the state, but if the marriage is accepted as legal where it is formed, it is legal in any state, I have always found that as there is no such thing as a 'common law' divorce, the only way to end a legal marriage is by divorce, death, or annullment or have the grounds for having the marriage declared void. Everything i have researched has told me that in any state in this country that if you have a living spouse, and are not divorced from that spouse, you cannot enter into a valid marriage, because in order to enter into a marriage, you have to be free to do so. It is a mess and I have researched so much for so many months, my eyes are crossed.

You are right also concerning your last paragraph. One should research and understand what is what about things, or just remain quiet and if the topic interests you enough to engage with it, then you will have some basic knowledge of the different components that make up the entire thing. I do know this much, This is a big can of worms here, and as advised by knowledgeable veteran assistant here who helps vets and knows how things are and is a Nam Vet himself, Don't give up...don't throw your hands up in despair as you will have all the red tape shoveled on you by the VA that they can possibly put there, trying to force you to just throw your hands up and walk away. He got down all the Vet stuff and as we went thru my situation, he said, from what he could see and the circumstances, I am the widow..But I will give it one hell of a fight, and I will also begin a fight to keep the life long promise I made to him. He fought, he suffered, and was never whole again, and he deserves the honor of being among all of those brave men that either died in combat, or was as many are, the walking dead, or served our country in any way. I only know of 2 campaigns he would speak of and I so want to know the history of his time in Nam. I can only hope that the two children he fathered know and realize why he was as he was, and be proud of their dad, and I would hope they would research the whole thing and then they could understand a little more. But , enough from me.

Gail

Thank you all,

Gail