How long is Agent Orange toxic? The answer!

[jamescripps2]

As the first veteran to be granted AO exposure at a post or base inside CONUS, I am asked many questions. The most prevalent question is," how long is AO toxic after application",  for the purpose, and in the amount, needed to win an AO claim outside of Vietnam and Korea. The short answer is that there is no answer. In order to win my claim I had a statement from the world's foremost agent orange expert who states that once AO enters the sub soil, 100 years. On the other hand, some experts reply that it quickly evaporates in the foliage and tends to never make it to the ground, and even if it does, the residuals are not detectable and are non toxic after three days in sunlight.

The real answer is that, after application, Agent Orange remains toxic after application for as long as you can get can an expert to to say that it is!  That expert needs to back up his expert opinion with a sound rational supported by  experience, education, and/or scientific principles.

It seems as though the VA uses the expert opinion of their choice to deny claims, while the DOD and the US government use a different expert opinion of their own choice to award untold millions for cleanup of toxic soil in Vietnam, fifty years after the fact! Where are your environmental experts, and how do you locate them? They are the top toxicology professors at the numerous colleges and universities across America. How do you get a statement from someone with such glorious credentials? Do your DD and research to find out where such professionals are located and email them. Tell them what you need and why you need it. I emailed the top five toxicology professors across the US and received three highly probative statements. One of those experts who wrote a statement worked for the CDC. in Atlanta GA. and had been involved in AO research.

If you can get that kind of expert evidence in your claims folder, it is unlikely that the VA can refute it and you didn't pay $10.000 for the expert opinion. You will still face a uphill battle that I would expect to only be awarded at the BVA or COVA. Be mindful and aware, it takes three elements to win your direct exposure AO claim. You still need to have a diagnosis of one of the AO recognized disease and at least one well written nexus letter. I would suggest several nexus letters. I had thirteen nexus letters and never paid more than a medicare co-payment for any of them. As there is no presumptive of exposure outside of Korea and Vietnam, you will need to show exactly how, when, and where you was directly exposed to AO. If you don't have one of the diseases on the AO list, but you are convinced that your disease may have been caused by AO exposure, anywhere, at any time during service, you then have an uphill and almost insurmountable battle. Not an impossible scenario but definitely not a task for the faint of heart. You will need rock solid IMOs and IMEs. You will need to be tenacious and focused, do your research and respond with all of the DD that it is going to require of you. My advice on a claim like that is that if you don't intend to finish it, then don't start it.

There are opinions that most AO claims have already been filed and decided long ago, so why would I be posting something like this? Just wait until the proposed new AO conditions are added to the AO list and you will understand, new claims will come out of the woodwork, and that is the reason why I went to the trouble to post this information.

Edited June 21, 2020 by jamescripps2

[GBArmy]

Thanks James to a guy who "has been there, done that." Sound advice for those who may consider filing a claim.

[Berta]

GREAT Post James-The Hatfield Report ( i this very old post I made here), certainly supports what you said:

https://community.hadit.com/topic/20265-ao-korea-unit/

"Just wait until the proposed new AO conditions are added to the AO list and you will understand, new claims will come out of the woodwork, and that is the reason why I went to the trouble to post this information."

I felt I gave Secretary Willie an excellent letter, to thoroughly consider Ischemic stroke as due to AO in Vietnam veterans , an an ischemic stroke is the same as the ischemia of heart disease in many medical ways.

Or vets with AO IHD awards should have a secondary CVA, due to ischemia, service connected as secondary with no problem.,if the CVA happens after their EED for the AO IHD.

Also I used the most recent NAM report ( which might well be the LAST NAM report on AO,) to advance a good argument as to why HBP in Vietnam veterans should be SCed directly  to AO.

I have posted a few BVA AO HBP awards here  and there are also many on remand. 

A link to that report is here in the AO forum.

I also filed an accrued claim on my husband's HBP and used the Nam report to back it up, as the vets ,who the BVA awarded , did as well. 

A lot has happened since the Hatfield Report- C 123s AO link, Blue Water Navy AO regs, Korea regs expanded, etc etc etc -so things have changed a lot  from the olden days when my husband was in the AO Settlement Fund1992.

But I wonder WHEN he (Secretary Wilkie)will make a decision on the potential new presumptives, and how many vets will die before they even get a regulation ( if Sec Wilkie ever does add more disabilities to the AO list.)

If a Vietnam vet has had the VA deem their HBP as "essential" that means medically 'no know cause.'

They now have a "cause"- AO.

I will check today at BVA to see if there are more recent 2020 AO HBP claims.

You left not a single stone unturned and you Succeeded!!!!!!

A vet ,who does not fall under the Vietnam, BWN, Korea, Thailand regs, who is trying to prove exposure to AO -has to do the same thing.

Your experience was an Overwhelming Victory for ALL Veterans.

 

 

 

 

 

 

Edited June 20, 2020 by Berta
added more

[jamescripps2]

Thanks Berta and GBarmy, we should all get together some day to compare battle scars and wounds of our well fought VA battles. As you know well, those battles reshaped our lives and altered not only our futures, but also the future hopes and dreams of our family members. There is a well defined road to success in a VA claim if one can ever find their way through the maze, remain focused, and outlive the process.