VSO states they work for the VA not for ME

[GeekySquid]

So, as some know I have been having a little war with the VA and my VSO, the American Legion, about getting my DBQ's.

So today I went to the VSO's office in the VARO building during their "walk in" hours since I could not get them to give me an appointment.

On the door was as sign saying the office was closed for the week for training and left the 800 number for Washington DC office.

I knock on the door anyway. Two ladies answer.

Tell them what I want and that I need them to do it today.

They invite me into the office.

I hand them a typed sheet with the Dates and Dr's of my C&P's and a list of documents for each one that I need.

The first lady says she doesn't know why I am there. The second lady says she will help me. The first lady says show me how we do this.

Okay

I tell them again what I want and the 2nd lady says why do you want to file a NOD, I tell her. She says you don't need these files to file an appeal.......The VA already has them. I tell her I need to know exactly what the DBQ says and what the letters to and from VA says. I also need the code sheets as they existed at each point for each approved and denied C&P.

She tells me no i don't and if I insist on filing a NOD I should just file an HLR.. I told her no, that would not work for this and the HLR results are not typically veteran friendly.

She then spends 20 minutes more telling me that I need to listen to her because veterans don't know what they want and don't know anything about the VA and how to win their claim.

She then says "We work for the VA not for you, and the VA knows what it is doing".

this of course makes me mad and I say to her " I am asking you to get me these files. nothing more. I have heard your opinion and all you need to do is get me copies of these files." She then starts in again trying to convince me not to file.

I get more insistent and tell her that i heard her but I expect her to do exactly as I requested, nothing more.

She then says "Well you don't need those files so let me file the NOD" I tell her NO. Resoundingly empathically NO>

She then tells me I know how to file a NOD. She then remembers I am filing a CUE and says "you shouldn't file a CUE because you will never win and then the VA will be mad at you"......

Just f'ing wow.

Then I tell her once again to do what I asked her to do and to stop trying to dissuade me from what I want. I tell her she is wasting her time and mine and that all I want is her to get those documents.

She then yells to the other woman to get "Bill".  Man comes in and says "those are VA files you don't get to have them".

I tell him he is wrong and ask who he is. He refuses to answer. I look at woman 2 and say Please tell me your full name so I have a record. She wants to know why. I tell her point blank, that the next time I speak to AL in DC I am going to reference her and what she has said and not done. I then look at "Bill" and ask his name. He tells me 'you don't need to know that". I tell him I do because saying "Bill from AL means nothing to anyone". He snaps back 'I don't work for AL I work for VFW".

I ask him why he is sticking his nose into an AL situation? He gets mad and leaves.

She writes down her name, at least I think it is her name, date and time .

Then says all she is going to do is fill out a FOIA.  At this point I decide to let her do that and get a copy to submit with my complaint to the AL.

 She then asks me what I want. Types that I want my C-file and the files on the attached sheet, prints it, shoves it at me and says to Sign it. I tell her no it is not accurate and ask for a pen and write explicitly what  I want.

She literally tries to argue with me.

I tell her to stop arguing and write the FOIA the way I tell her.

She writes it wrong in her own phrasing and i made her redo it.

Then I made her add Time is of the essence on the form.

When she handed it to me. I initialed before and after the typing and drew a line threw the blank space.

She gasped and asked why I did that. I said "its blank space and anyone could add words to that blank space. She then started to say, and got half way through saying

'I needed to put more stuff...." and then shut up as she realized she was admitting to falsifying a FOIA over my signature.

 

I am not sure which is worse, having the people with my POA try and screw me over or having the VA which is supposed to be on my side try and Screw me over.

 

[GeekySquid]

2 hours ago, robert51 said:

your in a hurry maybe you can find someone else

sad, disturbing, angering, but not surprising to me

[GBArmy]

Robert51, Were you able to get a VSO finally out there and get what you needed? If not, and you have some disability issues still open, that's why we are here. Let us know if we can help on any assistance.

[retiredat44]

I also have had very bad things happen, at VSO offices.... I have been called stupid, I have been told they refused to file for things and I had to write my own with no help from them, I have been dumped because of people moving around and they didn't have time to help me, even though I was already  a client, and the goes on.... I cannot tell how many times lots of time was wasted as I ended up waiting, or not getting any help. When someone in the forums ask if we should use a VSO, I was very hesitant to even say maybe. And I saw anger (from VSO's who read these forums) when some people told stories of the bad stuff. We either lose because of bad ones or we lose years of time because we couldn't get someone to type a couple of words. I could tell some bad stories, some good ones too, but I think my biggest advice is, if you think you are going to lose a date because of some bad people, write the paper yourself to make sure the date it held in place. Use it as a place holder. I found that even is huge cities that often it is impossible to find someone to help. I cannot tell you how many times I had to spend weeks phoning and driving looking for people and VSO's to help, only to get nowhere. Cities like San Diego. Even bad experiences in Oregon with bad problems with getting help. I have left offices so low I was in tears. Or so angry my heart was going to explode.

[McRay]

Geeky, kudos to you for having the tenacity to go through that ordeal and not explode. I would have ended up being belligerent and hostile and not gotten anything accomplished. You always write thoughtful posts here and I learn from them. Thanks

My experience with VSO's is limited to Florida. Along with DAV, VVA and the other big ones, Florida has county VSOs, probably because of so many retired Vets there. My experience with those guys has been good. DAV was a waste for me, Viet Nam Vets actually helped and pointed me in the right direction.

Geeky, your experience confirms my belief that most all experience with VA and claims is an US vs THEM thing. I don't know if it's designed that way or a result of bureaucracy -- doesn't matter -- end result is the same. If I had it to do over I would have consulted an atty from the beginning (I know one guy who's even helped Vets file initial claims). Of course atty's aren't all good, but the profit motivation may keep the bureaucratic mess a little cleaner.

As a final thought, a VA nurse suggested I join the American Legion at one of my appointments. Had she not done that, things would have been a lot different.

[rsm-esq]

This is terrible... sorry you had to go through all of this just to get your records.

[GBArmy]

McRay, you bring to mind what is repeated over and over on here. "DAV was a waste for me, Viet Nam Vets actually helped and pointed me in the right direction. " Which really means some VSO's at one Service Organization were more helpful than others at another Service Organization. It is the individual you dealt with at each one, NOT the organization that you had the experience with. The point  is it is always the individual that does or doesn't not make the difference. We all generalize and that is not helpful for new veterans coming on looking for help. Some  might read what you said and think "ok, I'm going to go to VVA because they are good and the DAV isn't." I don't have any preference myself, and had not great sucess with the DAV. All they did for me was input the claim. I couldn't get any help in developing the claim or viability in the process. Totally my fault and I accept full responsibility for the failure. But, you know what, I thank them for it. I learned a good lesson  which is at the end of this novel.  I tend to not bother with any of them now because I probably know  and can do a better job on my issues than they can. I don't mean to be boastful either. I mean,  I know what I know and don't know. If I don't know, I find out by going to good sources, like Hadit, and get the answers needed to make the decision. That works for me. VSO are useful in that they can be a source for procedures, forms, etc. but you don't want to accept their answers without checking it out for your self. And, they really can help if they have VBMS, which allows them to get real time viability on what's going on with your claim.
If you hit upon a great VSO, that is super. Just remember one thing; there is absolutely no one who is a better advocate for you than yourself, and don't forget it. So, every veteran with a claim issue should be doing the lion's share of the work on his claim. If it isn't done right, then you know who's at blame and can fix it.